darkSpyro

Quote: SkyFan91

So is this even a thread about VV anymore? Lol

These days I think we should all be happy just to have people making any sort of comment on any post. Really not much to talk about.

True. And it seems like fewer people on ds lately.

Quote: kaosmumishot

Quote: SkyFan91

So is this even a thread about VV anymore? Lol

These days I think we should all be happy just to have people making any sort of comment on any post. Really not much to talk about.

and its gonna get even worse in a year time, when there is only the lame tv show left....

SOOOOOOOO BACK ON TOPIC, I really like VV's artstyle. It's so colourful and unique IMO.

Quote: SkyFan91

SOOOOOOOO BACK ON TOPIC, I really like VV's artstyle. It's so colourful and unique IMO.

Colourful, yes, unique.... on that I'm torn. On the one hand they make some beautiful levels, and when they run buttery smooth like on the PS4/Xbone/Wii U, they are astounding to behold. On the other hand, they can make some dreary tosh, and even their best levels can become tired in a matter of minutes. What brings down their art style the most for me is the length of the levels they've designed. I wouldn't mind gawking at the mouthwatering visuals, but when I'm there for 40 minutes I start to think it becomes a matter of style over substance. There's only so many bright colour and explosive particle effects I can take before I get bored.

These work well for their characters though. I do like Countdown's bouncy emoting, or Wash Bucker's slimy swagger!

I think they could use some more palette variation too. They're colorful, but with the exception of TWI, it's all similar shades. TFB isn't afraid of getting stuff like Dragon Temple or Future of Skylands no matter how garish some combinations seem on paper, and it's a lot more eyecatching.

Quote: Bifrost

I think they could use some more palette variation too. They're colorful, but with the exception of TWI, it's all similar shades. TFB isn't afraid of getting stuff like Dragon Temple or Future of Skylands no matter how garish some combinations seem on paper, and it's a lot more eyecatching.

I think that's why I have such a problem with remembering levels in VV games - they're pretty but they all blur together into "THE BLUE LEVEL" and "THE GREEN LEVEL", but if someone were to ask me if I remembered time travel in Skylanders I could think of all kinds of different levels. They had loads of themes, stuck to them and made some awesome set pieces. VV can do that also, but once again it's all without that soul that TFB does.

Quote: SkyFan91

SOOOOOOOO BACK ON TOPIC, I really like VV's artstyle. It's so colourful and unique IMO.

everything needed to be said have been said, so there is no need to regurgitate this all over again.

Wow, aren't you a source of infinite knoweldge then. We can regurgitate the subject all we damn want, it's more on topic than your idea of discussion.

Has anyone other than Drawdler talked about their lock puzzles? 'Cuz darn they really don't seem to get those. Spark and ??? is good mechanics wise but makes no sense in ancient ruins and whatnot, while Live Wire is just unwieldy and long for the sake of long. All Lockmaster Imp puzzles from TFB might be annoying at times, but they're super fast paced and are just about shaking a lock around, fitting anywhere.

I'm still have the opinion that TfB reused the lockimp gameplay too much and didn't try to make entirely use puzzles lile VV did. I feel like they should have done more like VV in that regard, while also having occasional traditional lock imp puzzle.

I far preferred the Shock and Bolt puzzles, even if they didn't particularly make sense in the game's world. The problem I had with the greebly/imp puzzles was the time it took to turn the lock, and for control to return to the player when the greebly thud on the surface.

Quote: CountMoneyBone

Quote: SkyFan91

SOOOOOOOO BACK ON TOPIC, I really like VV's artstyle. It's so colourful and unique IMO.

everything needed to be said have been said, so there is no need to regurgitate this all over again.

Be that as it may in your opinion, there's no need to be like that about it. Should you want to discuss something you have as much right as anyone else to make another thread. I'd encourage you do so as it's then easier to find information about said subject, whereas here people can discuss Vicarious Visions.

I'm relatively new here. I've not had much of my say, and if I've missed something I can add it when reminded. It's also good for me because I'm working on a review for SWAP Force, and a second pair of eyes (or third, or however many people are in this thread) are a blessing when writing a script.

EDIT: Can't stand the lock puzzles in Supercharged. Nice idea, but it's Crash Bash in its actual controls.

Quote: Johnbonne

I far preferred the Shock and Bolt puzzles, even if they didn't particularly make sense in the game's world. The problem I had with the greebly/imp puzzles was the time it took to turn the lock, and for control to return to the player when the greebly thud on the surface.

Quote: CountMoneyBone

Quote: SkyFan91

SOOOOOOOO BACK ON TOPIC, I really like VV's artstyle. It's so colourful and unique IMO.

everything needed to be said have been said, so there is no need to regurgitate this all over again.

Be that as it may in your opinion, there's no need to be like that about it. Should you want to discuss something you have as much right as anyone else to make another thread. I'd encourage you do so as it's then easier to find information about said subject, whereas here people can discuss Vicarious Visions.

I'm relatively new here. I've not had much of my say, and if I've missed something I can add it when reminded. It's also good for me because I'm working on a review for SWAP Force, and a second pair of eyes (or third, or however many people are in this thread) are a blessing when writing a script.

EDIT: Can't stand the lock puzzles in Supercharged. Nice idea, but it's Crash Bash in its actual controls.

If you look back at the dates there had been 7 days with no comment on this thread before I asked my off topic question. It hardly matters if it's off topic if the topic is dead. But some people - who are in denial - don't realise that Skylanders is dead and this site is unfortunately slowly dying as well. So whereas in the past some people may have felt justified for complaining about things going a little off topic, I still maintain that people should be grateful for ANY comments being made on this site. I'm grateful even for your largely unnecessary and off topic comment.

So maybe a little less of the worrying what sections are put in or where a conversation goes and more being thankful that there's any conversation at all.

Quote: kaosmumishot

Quote: Johnbonne

I far preferred the Shock and Bolt puzzles, even if they didn't particularly make sense in the game's world. The problem I had with the greebly/imp puzzles was the time it took to turn the lock, and for control to return to the player when the greebly thud on the surface.

Quote: CountMoneyBone

everything needed to be said have been said, so there is no need to regurgitate this all over again.

Be that as it may in your opinion, there's no need to be like that about it. Should you want to discuss something you have as much right as anyone else to make another thread. I'd encourage you do so as it's then easier to find information about said subject, whereas here people can discuss Vicarious Visions.

I'm relatively new here. I've not had much of my say, and if I've missed something I can add it when reminded. It's also good for me because I'm working on a review for SWAP Force, and a second pair of eyes (or third, or however many people are in this thread) are a blessing when writing a script.

EDIT: Can't stand the lock puzzles in Supercharged. Nice idea, but it's Crash Bash in its actual controls.

If you look back at the dates there had been 7 days with no comment on this thread before I asked my off topic question. It hardly matters if it's off topic if the topic is dead. But some people - who are in denial - don't realise that Skylanders is dead and this site is unfortunately slowly dying as well. So whereas in the past some people may have felt justified for complaining about things going a little off topic, I still maintain that people should be grateful for ANY comments being made on this site. I'm grateful even for your largely unnecessary and off topic comment.

So maybe a little less of the worrying what sections are put in or where a conversation goes and more being thankful that there's any conversation at all.

I don't disagree that the site and especially the franchise are getting less popular, but I personally think the site looks a whole lot livelier if we remained on topic and made new ones for people to talk about things. But that's just my perception, just as CMB may have their own, or yours, which I respect. It's good we can address criticisms and things, but I'd rather it not be at the cost of good discussion and without snarkiness. As I said in the text after that you'd highlighted, I'd gladly pop into a new thread and see how it develops, which may be better than going on the same one and not be able to contribute because the discussion has changed (see the general thread on this Imaginators forum; should I not post in a few days, I may miss my chance to talk about the specific thing before the subject is changed seemingly at random). I'm grateful for discussion when it's pleasant to read and contribute to.

Apologies once again for going off. I'm glad we have an active community, but I'd rather it be one that encourages new discussion rather than closing down existing ones, however repetitive it might seem. As I also said earlier, I'm a new voice here, and I'd like to be heard on topics that I may not be aware existed before.

I don't think it would be healthy for me to dwell on this so I hope nothing's come between any of us. How do folks feel about VV's sound design? I personally find their music to be bombastic without being obnoxiously loud or taking away from that Skylanders feel. They really now how to set up a level as being an explosive adventure, which is a stark contrast to Skylanders' other calm and humble tracks at time. They create a good mood and add life to the levels that I find are rather soulless.

Kaos's comment aside, the music is done by Lorne Balfe. Great composer his best work was in Superchargers for sure

Quote: SkyFan91

Kaos's comment aside, the music is done by Lorne Balfe. Great composer his best work was in Superchargers for sure

Y'know that name sounds really familiar, but I've no idea where I've seen it before. I've checked his discography and I can see he's done some high profile films' music, but not much that I would've paid attention to. I didn't realise he'd done all the Skylanders' soundtracks though, that's admirable. It's interesting how his style changes around the developers, intentionally or otherwise. Maybe he does a Stewart Copeland and reviews the gameplay before making a soundtrack (after listening to Destiny 2's polarising OST during gameplay, I find the Copeland method to be far superior).

Yeah, he's the identity of the series. Superchargers was his worst imho however, not because the songs were bad, but they feel like an entirely different style. Wouldn't be surprised if he ditched the signature style because they knew he was going to get taken out of the team soon after.

I feel saying VV can’t make a solid Skylanders game is laughable. Trap Team was where the damage was done, not Superchargers being done. It wouldn’t have much mattered what the gimmick was (something they need to move away from with the toys moving forward if they are to move forward) as LEGO Dimensions was going to command a following.

The “trying to get and stay in bed with Nintendo” hurt as well as opposed to helping. The thought is the fall of the Wii collapsed the series, but it was them staying on the sinking ship that really made it hurt. I’m not sure how much VV was to blame for this, but I do know they were the ones who approached Nintendo to see if they could do it. All systems should have either had 2 exclusive pairings (Sony All-Stars show cases some good options, and characters from “Rare” would have worked for Xbox) or it should have been full compatibility or bust with the Nintendo figures. It doesn’t matter if you like them (I own and played the figures on my Nintendo as well), it was a bad move. It was the franchise’s chance to funnel the players over to heavier online, graphics capable systems with the racing feature in particular, but they screwed the pooch. The Wii U also has a better racing interface. Why the hell was it needed to give the other systems less racing options and a tougher interface? That is shooting yourself in the foot.

As far as “amount of content” goes, the two VV games blow away TfB games. It’s not even close when comparing their installment against the TfB follow-up. It doesn’t matter if you don’t like the racing or PvP arena.....it’s still content. The last two TfB games give you more characters but less to do....what’s the point. Superchargers also not only had the lowest requirement yet as far as investment needed to access the entire main story (Supercharger gates replaced elemental gates and were accessible from the box, and a single sea and sky vehicle would get you into all the story mode areas), but Heroic Challanges came back rewarding completionists with something special to do with every character you purchased.

Compare this to HAVING to have a “gimmick lander” of each element in the two latter TfB installments to gain access to the “elemental gimmick gates” yet not gain anything extra for having the 2nd (or 3rd) gimmick lander if that element. They also abused and pummeled collectors and completionists with the Trap And creation crystals, which in turn pummeled stores with boards of Trap Crystals that just sat on store shelves.

The final point I’ll make at this juncture is how VV does a much better job controlling and respecting Power Creep. TfB doesn’t care. Giants weren’t unconditionally stronger then corelanders, but Trap Masters were markedly better then everything before, and Sensies above that. Swap Force and Superchargers didn’t do that. They didn’t propel their gimmicks in this “We’re superior to all” manner and instead add them in a parallel “We serve a special purpose” way, unlocking more special missions and the like. This, along with short changing villians by making them playable before they were even developed, has painted the series into a corner.

Okay, one last thing: Swap Force did something (and in a different manner SC) other games have failed to do by trying to honor previous gimmicks. There were special chests that only Giants could open. Now you only needed one Giant (which you only needed one to complete Giants as well) to utlilize this, but it’s something that gives them value moving forward. It also helps stores clear out old inventory by putting something in of nominal value for people who bother to get an older figure.

In short, Vicarious Visions has done plenty with their design that has been the gold standard in the series, and have been marked as a scape goat even though Trap Team did most of the damage to drive away the fan base in addition to the super sink that was LEGO dimensions strong arming a chunk of the toys to life space. The way forward is concentrating more on gameplay and stop painting the series into the corner with short lived gimmicks that demand too much design space and leaves most gamers wanting for more content. These only appeal to hardcore collector or kids from families with enough dough to keep the figures coming, since their content is just leveling up the characters with what little content there is to do the games. Again 5 mil games sold with 4 extra figs on avg. > then 1 mil games and 15 fig avg.

SF's sound design really loved honking and squeaking and LOUD magic moment noises. Thank god they ditched it for SC.

As for the level concepts not being realized, I think that'd because Dave isn't a level modeler, iirc he's just concept art and illustrations; you see his gigantic structures and painterly look, then ingame, no matter what the shader devs do, they can't really fix the fact the result is flat and with a feel that it was pasted on top of placeholders... I think this is most striking in Beta Spell Punk Library. I noticed on Artstation that TFB's ex-level artist, he has a very artistic style - even his personal projects have a lot of crooked or bent shapes that are very cartoony, and even a bridge or breakable props seem to have a personality of their own; yeah, clipping fest in action, but you have a lot more fun with the crazy angles and impossible structures. I hope he works on fantasy games again in the future, that dude is amazing.

https://latinmessiah.artstation.com/

He only posted props, but he listed his work as enviromental art, so I'll assume he did a lot more. There are a few others in the Skylanders tag as well ,like Ken Nguyen.

Oh yeah, VV sheep are way too detailed. Academy got a better inbetween design, where their eyes are detailed but they're still basically two ovals and four cylinders.

I think VV made good Skylanders games, but at the same time, they weren't good as Skylanders games - they felt too different from TFB, who I think were better of getting that feel to their games.

It's not exactly something I can put my finger on, but I know for sure that VV games felt very different to TFB games, especially the physics and graphics (VV were way too bright and cheery IMO).

Overall, I prefer TFB. OP Skylanders and janky physics, but memorable level design and story, that's what made me like Skylanders - compared to VV, whose games have nothing particularly bad, but nothing to write home about either.

TL;DR - VV < TFB, IMO.

Character designing : Their characters look like they belong to cartoons and they don’t feel as tough as TFB’s Skylanders , but their still cool and unique though.

Level design : I’m not really crazy about their levels from swap force , but I love their levels from Super Chargers and how unique they were.

Lore : They added so many good things to the lore and they expanded on it nicely.

Graphics : I love their graphics they’re so polished and high quality...Just look at the cinematic as from imaginators and Super Chargers they are so nice !!! Let’s not forget about the race tracks which are breath taking .

Post gameplay : They made amazing post gameplay for Swap force and it’s the best in the series in my opinion . However, I can’t say the same thing about SC , but that’s probably because they haven’t had enough time to add more post-game play.