darkSpyro

I mean, in Swap Force there were Time and Vortex Spell Punks, and Gear Golems in the Adventure packs. Now that the actual fabric of reality is being torn apart, what better time to introduce the elements of Time and Space? Just a though, who agrees?

No, just no. We literally just got light and dark last game

Quote: TTD

Definitely not. Furthermore, a time binding skylander already exists - Déjà Vu and she is in the magic element so introducing a 'time and space' element wouldn't make sense, especially if she isn't included.

Exactly, we would have the some problem if they would add a Ice and a Lightning element. There are several existing Skylanders that already have Ice/Lightning powers like Chill, Thunderbolt, Free Ranger, Freeze Blade etc.

I don't think so, because we have some skylanders with moves suited for different elements
for example most of 's moves revolve around fire
and as for new elements I would love those Time, Space, Lightning, and Ice

doubtfull, not hoping for it either.

If they can't make enough skylanders for Light and Dark to even out the numbers across the elements, they shouldn't even bother with new ones. Eating more than you can chew and all that.

Nope too soon, maybe in 4 years

But we technically already know they exist...

They'll introduce more elements... When they want even more money.

Quote: ninja9351

But we technically already know they exist...

Just because they're things that happen doesn't mean they have to be entire elements. Space doesn't need an element. Plot doesn't need an element. Game Programming isn't an element though I could guess the devs wish it was. Not everything needs its super specific category,leave it at Magic.

Honestly, Dark could have worked as a Magic sub-category and Light *kinda* the same, or even Air.
Just some color and design tweaks and you have 4 new Skylanders for already exsisting Elements.

But they did make them unique in terms of movesets and theme so I am actually happy they introduced them.

Regarding Time and Space... No.
I don't think they will happen.
Magic already proved to be perfect for those themes (Déjà Vu, Enigma, Hoot Loop) and Blackout can create vortexes to transport himself.
Magic is where all the unexplainable powers, abilities and creatures go: we have music based powers, an alchemist, a creature from another dimension and an alien, an ancient mistic beetle, a whimsical howl and even a character with telekinetic powers (which could easily relate to science too).

This is what Magic is for in my opinion.

I really don't think they need to introduce any more elements. The two new ones they just introduced are still grossly underrepresented as it is. I think they need to add more of those first. Or at least make Luminous, Blaster-Tron, Nightshade, and Tae Kwon Crow into full fledged Skylanders.

Quote: Drek95

Honestly, Dark could have worked as a Magic sub-category and Light *kinda* the same, or even Air.
Just some color and design tweaks and you have 4 new Skylanders for already exsisting Elements.

Well, that all depends on whether you consider the original "Dark" variation to be the same thing as the Dark element versus the original explanation of Spyro being corrupted by/infused with "Dark" magical energy. Since multiple characters who aren't of the Magic element were released in the two Dark Starters released so far, Magic and Dark being two parts of the same element wouldn't really work, unfortunately.

-Doug

Dark used to be just Dark Magic, or at least implied to be, so it was more of an additional, only sorta playable element because it was corrupting existing ones. Dark is still not exactly The Darkness since it can also be corrupted(TT 3DS Midnight Museum), so the corrupting, evil magic thing is still going around and not exactly its own special element unless you count Kaos Element. I don't since it's just labeling the big bad.

Quote: darkchylde28

Quote: Drek95

Honestly, Dark could have worked as a Magic sub-category and Light *kinda* the same, or even Air.
Just some color and design tweaks and you have 4 new Skylanders for already exsisting Elements.

Well, that all depends on whether you consider the original "Dark" variation to be the same thing as the Dark element versus the original explanation of Spyro being corrupted by/infused with "Dark" magical energy. Since multiple characters who aren't of the Magic element were released in the two Dark Starters released so far, Magic and Dark being two parts of the same element wouldn't really work, unfortunately.

-Doug

No, I was talking about the characters themselves.
Knight Mare and Blackout would have been perfect in Magic (maybe even Undead) same goes for Knight Light and Spotlight in Air, with just a few tweaks.

But I admit their abilities and designs really sets them apart from those three Elements so yes as they are right now they wouldn't have been so in line with the other Magic and Air Skylanders.

But as Bifrost said, Dark is likely to be "Dark Magic" not the Darkness itself, and I guess Light is also a Magic derivation.
All the Dark variants have just black, silver and purple effects because they have been corrupted but the Dark Skylanders were born infused with that very same Element.

I'd go as far as saying Magic splitted in half creating them (or maybe the opposite) when all the Skylands and the Elements came to be.
Magic is everywhere in that world and each creature is more or less influenced by it.

Quote: ninja9351

I mean, in Swap Force there were Time and Vortex Spell Punks, and Gear Golems in the Adventure packs. Now that the actual fabric of reality is being torn apart, what better time to introduce the elements of Time and Space? Just a though, who agrees?

No-one knows what they have planned for future games.

So anything could potentially happen.

There may be something with a future game that is similar to Swap Force, where by the Skylanders can change element with the one they are weakest against, like for example Eruptor becoming Water and so on.

More than likely wouldn't happen, but it's a thought.

I doubt it but we'll know for certain if the poster has a few "?" on it like last year. Man I hope they don't EVER release new stuff they way they did Dark and Light. Every time Eon said "You need a Trap Master of an unknown Element to open this gate" I wanted to play something else...such a negative experience (at least for me).

Quote: Tigorus

I doubt it but we'll know for certain if the poster has a few "?" on it like last year. Man I hope they don't EVER release new stuff they way they did Dark and Light. Every time Eon said "You need a Trap Master of an unknown Element to open this gate" I wanted to play something else...such a negative experience (at least for me).

That was tied to the Traptanium Elemental Gates' problem.
I'm sure it won't be repeated and hope they'll add new Elements just for the fun of it, in the future (if they want to).

Tbh I think we needed Ice from the beginning , for new elements I don't mind space and time but I wont care if we don't get them. Anyways no new elements this time maybe next game or game 7 that is if the franchise doesn't stop. But what I am dying for is a Poison and Fairy elements.

No more new elements, please. Having Light and Dark is enough for me.

honestly it sounds more of the younger fans are the ones that would want more elements as those older already see how many there are and how much convoluted it would be to introduce more over what has come out. too many figures and the way of release. the whole unknown element thing is pretty stupid and there was no reason to do that for a game. i haven't touched trap team yet and that sounds horrible to do as in the most pay walls for a game ever in order to have any functionality. sorry but i think 10 is fine as some people already agree. there's too much to program in there with each installment and how it's going, the vehicles would be enough of a distraction and especially if they are only doing approx 1 light and dark element for the next game, so why would they introduce more than that?

I'm of the opinion that the 10 we have fits the needs and artistic expression of most portal meistas out there. The franchise is already getting cluttered and confusing--not good for a kid's game.

Quote: AdamGregory03

They'll introduce more elements... When they want even more money.

They wouldve done it already if that were the case

The only problem with ding new elements is that everything is already covered. They stretched it With Light and Dark, because Dark characters could also fit with Undead, and Light with air or magic. If anything, the could reveal that there are opposite Portal Masters, not Dark ones, but they like, idk, close portals, and have the "Kaos" element and then the other. But other than that, the Gears/Time were obviously Tech, while Vortex powers are Air

I also have a question, why are elements even important? So we get elemental power...big whoop. Does anyone actually switch to the appropriate element when this comes up? I know I never have and simply play the Skylanders I WANT to play. Previously they opened certain doors but based on what info. has been made available there are no elementally aligned gates in Super Chargers...at all. So again what would adding more elements do?

Now I think a better question to ask is how can the elemental aspect actually make a difference in game play. Shouldn't Magic Skylanders do more damage to Tech based enemies like Trolls and mechanical constructs? Shouldn't Water Skylanders do more damage to Fire enemies? Shouldn't Life Skylanders take more damage from Fire enemies? It goes on and on but my point is that the current elemental state doesn't matter but it REALLY should. It would add so much more depth to the game.

^Agreed. Elements need to be given new roles, especially now that one of their most important roles has been removed.

Quote: Muffin Man

^Agreed. Elements need to be given new roles, especially now that one of their most important roles has been removed.

But using them as keys was shamless way to sell toys. I get that this franchise needs to sell toys and I usually want to buy them. I should be buying them because I want their specific type of game play or because of their fun factor. I would like to see a show of hands for all those that bought Blaster Mind just so they could finally open Magic Traptanium gates in Trap Team (raises own hand). My main point is that the "gate key" feature should never have been the most important elemental feature and that elements should have played a more active and consequential roles in game play. I LOVE that the pay walls gates are gone but there's no doubting that Elements are more useless in Super Chargers than ever. Don't get me wrong the game looks amazing and fun as hell but the elements seem to be going the way of Heroics...just a memory.

I wasn't disagreeing with anything you just said. I'm glad they are gone as paywalls. But it was still an important role, regardless, and now they need a new important role to take its place (such as Water element Skylanders being more effective against fire based enemies).

Quote: Muffin Man

I wasn't disagreeing with anything you just said. I'm glad they are gone as paywalls. But it was still an important role, regardless, and now they need a new important role to take its place (such as Water element Skylanders being more effective against fire based enemies).

Oh totally agree. The only reason I bolded your text was to illustrate that it was unfortunately their most important feature. But yeah I totally got that you agreeing...lol. Now I'm left with a "now what" regarding what the Elements actually do...other than Elemental Power.

Quote: Muffin Man

^Agreed. Elements need to be given new roles, especially now that one of their most important roles has been removed.

Elements were a HUGE deal in the first game. You even had specific areas tied to the elements (loosely tied to gates, but not always). They've gotten lazy now and simply have used gates, and even the themes in the gates don't even represent the element half the time.

So yeah, they've de-emphasized that. You could even say the elements WERE THE GIMMICK in the first game and has been the only thing that has tied all the game together (until SC anyway).

Yeah I guess it's just part of the same general problem that all the game-specific gimmicks have, now that you mention it. Instead of building on them, they kinda toss them aside so they don't detract focus from the next big thing.


Still, elements are such a strong concept that they really deserve to be developed into more than just a gimmick that gets left in the past. Plus, I mean, they did just add two new elements into the game, as we've all been mentioning. Why even bother adding them if elements are going to become irrelevant?

Introduce those two elements maybe six games later

Elements are important in terms of lore, character identity, design and are also more or less the basic fantasy feature in the majority of the child oriented media.

I agree they are rather pointless in gameplay as of now but as TakeYourLemons said they were used in a great way in SA which could have easily been expanded in future installments.
But no, they had to go with one and done gimmicks... Giants were cool, I always thought we needed big and super powerful Skylanders to represent each Elements but from SWAP Force on each innovation started to feel more and more "forced" and gimmicky.

We don't need more gimmicks and I think I speak for a lot of other users when I also say we don't want them.
Expand the Elements, make each one of them truly unique and give us a big and deep game with 20/40 new Cores and a big world to explore with quests and puzzles to solve, enemies to battle, underwater swimming, flying and other ways of moving (not using vehicles) and everything else you can think about.

I was really hoping to get all of this from the fifth game but I think V.V. only cares about changing as much as they can and calling it "new" while trying to keep a general Skylanders feeling (to me they kinda already crossed that line) so I guess it's up to TfB now to do the magic.
I hope they read our suggestions and listened to us (I'm sure V.V. would have too but the majority of the most interesting ideas I've seen only came up when SuperChargers was already in advanced development).

That's what I would call true innovation.
Not a bunch of vehicles and revamped old characters.

Quote: Drek95

I was really hoping to get all of this from the fifth game but I think V.V. only cares about changing as much as they can and calling it "new" while trying to keep a general Skylanders feeling (to me they kinda already crossed that line) so I guess it's up to TfB now to do the magic.
I hope they read our suggestions and listened to us (I'm sure V.V. would have too but the majority of the most interesting ideas I've seen only came up when SuperChargers was already in advanced development).

That's what I would call true innovation.
Not a bunch of vehicles and revamped old characters.

Right, like the numerous paywalls was magic enough? i'm so looking forward to trap team playing with having to have atleast 1 trap per element and spending 15 bucks each for atleast 8 elements (2 come in dark starter) just to get 100%? tfb's magic since giants has been pretty bad to milking people for money. i'll give superchargers credit for toning it down where it should be per game. there's a point where a gimmick is too much and people aren't going to pay for all of it, especially with so much competition now. it's better people are interested in 20 or so that will actually buy all of them they like instead of just several. there's a bigger loss in mass production. acti needs to understand that a yearly investment of 500+ is ridiculous and is gone and not going to come back because of so many. in fact, i think people should thank the other entries for the fact of the lower number of figs to a point that they will feel they matter for this game and not be one and done to an extent, eventhough vehicles will be.

I really don't want to support the franchise longer if the gimmicks are just so presided over the story and lore. Spyro's adventure and giants were ok but at the same time, it started getting out of control for swap force on figures.

And on another point as far as gimmicks go, vehicles is like your brick wall. So they would really have to think outside of the box but the problem is for the toys they've done just that in 5 games so there's not much to say they will have more ideas that will be too similar to each other going forward. I expect quality to drop now.

I'll put it simply:
I prefer to pay more and have more fun than pay less but also have less fun.
Of course I would love to pay less and still enjoy it a lot but I have the feeling this won't happen, at least not this year.

I said I hope TfB will bring the series back to its former glory because I feel V.V. isn't taking it in the right direction for my personal tastes.
I don't know if they'll be able to do it but I certainly have more faith in them right now.

Quote: Drek95

I'll put it simply:
I prefer to pay more and have more fun than pay less but also have less fun.
Of course I would love to pay less and still enjoy it a lot but I have the feeling this won't happen, at least not this year.

I said I hope TfB will bring the series back to its former glory because I feel V.V. isn't taking it in the right direction for my personal tastes.
I don't know if they'll be able to do it but I certainly have more faith in them right now.

Elementally speaking though, what glory would that be? My entire point is that they are getting rid of an already lame feature based on previous executions. The elemental alignment has ALWAYS MOSTLY BEEN FOR UNLOCKING DOORS (sorry for the caps but this has always irritated me to no end lol) !!!! That's kind of lame and doesn't really lend itself to any kind of previously defined elemental system. Combat bonuses, defenses, combos, etc. Also how awesome would it be if in co-op mode you actually triggered elemental combos when certain effects were combined. Air and Water attacks could add a freezing effect. Fire and Water could add a brittle effect. Lightning and Water could stun, and so on and so on. These are things that one expects to find with an elemental system. Some kind of risk/reward balancing system. I know some individual characters have these combos on an individual scale but I'm talking globally. The only other feature is the Elemental Power rotation which just randomly adds a short term location bonus while you're there. It's always felt random and lazy as far as how it ties into the "Magic" of the Elements in Skylands. I would also love to know how much influence Activision has on these decisions since the Elemental Gate system determines how many figures one needs to buy to experience it all. I doubt it's fair to assign the blame solely to a single developer in this case since it has a direct impact on figure sales.

**Disclaimer**
Totally not picking on you Drek I'm just irritated at how Elemental crap has been handled. It still sucks but at least the pay wall has a few less bricks to overcome.

Elementally speaking SA had mostly the Elemental Gates but not only.

Fire Skylanders could walk inside lava and Water ones could swim.
The majority of the Air characters (and a couple from other Elements) could fly even over water and the Earth ones could destroy purple Tzo crystals.
4 (5 if you count a special vegetal bridge only Life characters could activate in the Perilous Pastures chapter) Elements out of 8 was a nice start for a game where the focus was the simple TtL tech.

They should really take those features, improve them (your ideas are absolutely great) and also add a couple more for Magic, Tech, Undead and Life and also some extra ones for Light and Dark.
Making each Element unique and important (without forced paywalls) is the key to bring back a lot of the SA magic in my opinion.

To be honest Elemental Gates didn't bothered me that much in the first game because I genuinely wanted to own a Skylander from each Element and I think the majority of the customers wanted the same.
But they should keep them as the only type of paywall or even ditch them entirely in favor of what I stated before.

I know V.V. isn't to blame for everything just like I think TfB wasn't responsible of the Traptanium Elemental Gates, however what I'm not liking about this game is also more or less what I didn't like about SWAP Force, except amplified: unneeded innovations and modifies, a style change and the lack of a number of specific featurs the other 3 TfB games had.
Those have to be V.V.'s choices!
Not to mention some Element specific features were still present up to SWAP Force which wiped them out.

We'll see how they'll deal with this entry.

I agree, we need more focus on the character designs and elements' mechanics. They are growing more tiresome every installment. Oh, what's that? More robots? More characters on fire? More plants shooting more plants? More rock monsters?
Things have been a little too on-the-nose and forcibly shoved into an element based on presentation, not originality. Why can't we have more Chopper's, Zoo Lou's and Hex's? Some of my favorite characters are the ones that break the mold and still represent their element.

On the subject of new elements, I know I have always been a bit of a downer of Light and Dark being added to the fold. Still, kind of am when it comes to a series where Light and Dark are considerably made staples of Good and Evil. And with things like Lightcores and Dark variants, it makes Light and Dark almost redundant to add. It is not like Pokémon adding a new type to change up game mechanics. Light and Dark were only added because they sound cool, and clearly, they serve no purpose. Also, PvP was tossed away, so we still have no idea how they interact with the other elements. It was poorly thought out, in my opinion.
I would like to see the series fix some of these things, and clear up some others, so that I have a reason to 'collect them all'. And, I sincerely hope we do not see any more limiting parameters in character designs.

I absolutely agree about characters design: Chopper, Wrecking Ball, Slobber Tooth, Warnado, Zoo Lou, Fryno, Short Cut and I have to say also Dive-Clops are all Skylanders who suits their specific Elements yet without feeling too obvious.

We will probably always get easy-made characters (fire creatures, rocky monsters, antropomorphic sea creatures, robots) because they cannot always come up with something 100% original and never seen before but there are some really no-brainer concepts (sand made golem, manticore, fairy, a character controlling a mecha) I thought we would have already seen before coming back at the bases.

I have to admit they always put a lot of effort in creating new and fun powers and abilities so even the not-so-originally designed Skylanders may end up being truly unique.

Great discussion about the elementals. They really felt NATURAL in the first game, making you think what kind of skylander you need to access an area not necessarily in front of a neon elemental gate. Of course, it's degenerated into that, but I loved that initial sense of exploration where IT WASN'T ALWAYS SPELLED OUT. As indicated, the use of the elementals is now trivial and totally pay-wall based and not tied to any adventuring.

In my mind, a "return to former glory" will make use of our noggin to solve ELEMENTAL PUZZLES. Imagine a puzzle that requires 2 or 3 elemental skylanders to get it done? Imagine having to solve quests to access other areas inside of a more enriched world, with more randomized enemy generation for battles?

Previous ideas of more open world would expand on the exploration concept. The run of the mill single path levels they've been spoon feeding us for 4 games is enough, thank you. Trust me, I'll be vocal enough once I have the finished product...for now we wait and see what we find.

Drek, I'm not totally down on SC yet, so hang in there. I think the end result will be better than what you're feeling--and no, I have no "proof" other than I have faith in their ability based on Swap Force.

Some of the previous complaints I think are coming from CORPORATE/MARKETING decisions and not DEVELOPER decisions...just food for thought.

I only saw the first Could Kingdom videos and they already showed some interesting branching.
So it's not open world (at least not yet) but they may be going in the right direction.

Couldn't agree more on Elements value: puzzles, specific features, hidden abilities, everything is welcomed as long as it isn't only obvious Elemental Gates.

I still have faith in both V.V. and SuperChargers but the more we know about this game the more I know what I'll get it's probably not even close to what I wanted.
The game will no doubt be great and super fun but I would have preferred the same effort... On a different subject.
It's fine, I'm neither their target nor the only exsisting customer so I will happily accept a game I don't like that much but still enjoy and appreciate.
Worse possible scenario I will get what I wanted next year.

Agreeing with folks regarding how getting away from the value of elements is not a good thing. Regarding SA, I really liked how the levels themselves (for the most part) were designated to an element. It's been a while, but there were about 3 levels per element, with a new NPC guide for each element representing that element, getting an artifact of that specific element. The level design was obviously shifted towards that element. Building the Core of Light was fun, and I honestly wish that Kaos would break it apart again so that we can get back to the roots of the original game.

I get why they went away from that and went with the Arkeyans (sp?), but they've drifted way too far now. Hopefully, defeating this doomstation thing will require some artifact from each element. We already know we visit Lightning Rods home world, it would be spectacular if we visited the home world of an original character of each element. Say Wrecking Ball, Trigger Happy, Zap, Sunburn, Bash, Ghost Roaster, Lightning Rod, Camo, Spotlight, Blackout. They could still bring back specific tasks that each element can do, such as swim, fly, walk on fire, etc. The gates were never a big deal to me, but I did like the themes.

As far as attack and defense bonuses, I don't really care that much. Unless you're playing on a difficult setting, it really doesn't matter much. Just give each level an elemental theme...make it so playing a fire level is better done with a fire element, whether that be by fire gates, walking on fire, or something specifically only a fire element can do. You can complete the level without a fire element, but it's much more fun with.