From the Direct today, we know that at launch:
- There will only be 5 maps
- 1 mode will be available (Turf War), with Splat Zones unlocking very shortly after launch once there's enough Level 10+ players
- The game will be updated throughout the Summer with several more maps, 2 more MP modes, more clothes and weapons, various events etc.
- You can join matches with friends at launch, but teams are randomized. Matchmaking with friends where you can have a specific Team A v.s. Team B, and pick a specific mode/map won't be out until the August update.
-no mic chat, not even in friend parties
-no customized rulesets, even in friend parties
-tacked on single player
-locking several dlc on disc for the cost of an amiibo.
-lobbies are nerfed as hell
Yeah....no. Definitely not purchasing Splatoon. Players will drop this game so hard.
darkSpyro - Spyro and Skylanders Forum > Video Gaming > Nintendo is charging full price ($60) for an unfinished game.
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#1 Posted: 19:20:57 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
|
TorchSheep
Emerald Sparx
Gems: 3376
|
#2 Posted: 19:25:04 07/05/2015
Though I understand a lot of your points and agree with some of them to an extent, I'd hardly call the single player mode 'tacked on'.
It looks like it has a very decent amount of thought and creativity put into it, I know the online feature is the main focus of the game, but the single player experience is looking like a huge part of the game too. I also have to agree with what Matteomax said in the All-Purpose topic, single-player is a good idea for people wanting to try out new techniques and also good for those that don't have great internet connections, like myself.
---
"I have my own system, don't get involved" |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#3 Posted: 19:27:28 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
5 maps.
1 mode until august 1v1 local only 3 mini games. No mic chat. Randomized parties. No rule customization. Majority of game content held behind amiibo, which is on disc from day 1. This is an awful, awful practice to consumers. I'm sorry, but the game seems incredibly rushed and at full price I cannot justify buying this game. |
Edited 2 times - Last edited at 19:28:16 07/05/2015 by zer0dch
|
|
TorchSheep
Emerald Sparx
Gems: 3376
|
#4 Posted: 19:32:13 07/05/2015
Okay, I do agree with you that Nintendo are pushing it a little here and it does seem like we're going have to wait a while for the full experience of this game. Which I'm personally okay with, but I can see why this would push away a lot of people.
Nintendo haven't handled this situation that well, but I still have faith in them that this game will still be a lot fun despite in what it's lacking at the moment.
---
"I have my own system, don't get involved" |
sonicbrawler182
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 7105
|
#5 Posted: 19:32:47 07/05/2015
I disagree with the tacked on single-player. IMO, the single-player looks like the most complete aspect of the game and at this point the part I am most excited about. Everything around it feels tacked on. Which is bass ackwards, as I was initially hyped for this as it looks really fun in multiplayer.
Also, "majority of the content locked behind Amiibo" is exaggerating things (they don't unlock new maps or characters), but I do agree that the functionality is terrible. They are basically locking TUTORIAL MISSIONS behind a pay wall, as well as gear (which ISN'T JUST COSMETIC as many people seem to believe), and those cool mini-games.
---
"My memories will be part of the sky." |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#6 Posted: 19:36:18 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Isn't the single player literally a hub world of three buildings with a variety of.missions to play? Because that sure as hell is tacked on.
Its also worth noting that all the people excited for this game are (or should I say, were) excited for the multiplayer component. You know, the mode that got revealed with the game and its fan base following? |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 19:46:58 07/05/2015 by zer0dch
|
|
TorchSheep
Emerald Sparx
Gems: 3376
|
#7 Posted: 19:51:00 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
Of course they would have been at first as it was the only that was shown off at E3 2014, but I think you're making a tad of a assumption there, most of the people that have had the chance to play the game said that the single-player was the most fun they had on the game. Filled with unique gameplay mechanics and a lot of strategy involved. These statements also came from pretty big YT names so I wouldn't be surprised if others are just as hyped to get time with the single-player.
---
"I have my own system, don't get involved" |
Bionichute
Yellow Sparx
Gems: 1889
|
#8 Posted: 19:53:32 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
The single player is a series of missions, yes, but you can literally say that about any video game with a single player mode. Also, 60$ plus free content added regularly. I've seen worse, like Evolve, which had a seriously tacked on, extremely short story mode witha bad ending, over 300$ worth of DLC on day one, and barely any variety in gameplay. Appreciate that they aren't doing that.
---
I'M A KAMEN RIDER //forum.darkspyro.net/spyro/viewposts.php?topic=129460 Check out my Skylanders game idea! |
|
sonicbrawler182
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 7105
|
#9 Posted: 19:56:40 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
No, the single player has it's own underground hub, and a bunch of levels within it, with collectibles and everything. It even has it's own unique upgrade system separate to the multiplayer customisation. And it seems like it has plenty of levels, and they look a lot like Super Mario Galaxy honestly.
---
"My memories will be part of the sky." |
CAV
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6289
|
#10 Posted: 19:57:03 07/05/2015
At least the updates are free rather than charging people for them under the guise of DLC. Shady as this is, it's still a step above others.
And these features aren't all gone forever either. They are promised to come out at a later date. If you don't want to buy it at launch more power to you but don't act like the game is being chopped up to bits and sold at a premium. Quote: zer0dch
You're being ridiculous. "Majority" of content is such an exaggeration it isn't even funny. And even while people complain about it being "locked content", I honestly prefer that they do this with the figures than do something tiny and insignificant (see: Toad) that make purchasing them actually worthwhile. EDIT: Also 5 maps, while not a huge amount, is still fairly decent at launch, especially when considering that additional maps will be added on within a couple of months after release for free. |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 19:59:06 07/05/2015 by CAV
|
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#11 Posted: 19:58:53 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: sonicbrawler182
Unfortunately though, the single player is a series of short missions that all seem redundant. Also, the internet is not taking Splatoon well. NeoGAF, gamefaqs and various other larger communities are pissed as all hell and calling the game that releases this May an "unfinished beta". |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#12 Posted: 20:01:23 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: CAV
The fact that the content is ON THE DISC and requires an additional purchase is awful. Do you not remember the huge backlash that Capcpom and several other developers got for content that was locked in disc behing a paywall? edit: **** I thought i was editing my post, not double posting. it's worth mentioning that five maps at launch is ridiculous. map rotation every four hours and ranked battles being locked until enough players reach a certain level is also an awful idea. Is Nintendo trying to kill this game? lol |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 20:02:53 07/05/2015 by zer0dch
|
|
Bionichute
Yellow Sparx
Gems: 1889
|
#13 Posted: 20:02:04 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
This is the first time I've heard of this supposed Splatoon hate. From what I've seen, theres been nothing but praise for the game. Also hahaha NeoGaf and GameFAQs, truly the places of sound individuals
---
I'M A KAMEN RIDER //forum.darkspyro.net/spyro/viewposts.php?topic=129460 Check out my Skylanders game idea! |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#14 Posted: 20:04:05 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: Bionichute
NeoGAF is actually quite a great site...? I don't get the hate towards GAF unless you hate the idea of insiders and communities, with strict punishment to those who act stupid. I used gamefaqs for reference. They do have a vocal opinion, however, some of it may just be **** posts. |
|
CAV
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6289
|
#15 Posted: 20:04:05 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
Would you rather the amiibo be worthless and a waste of money because there's not enough that they do? Loads of people still complain that amiibo aren't all that game changing because they are mostly used for unlocking little cosmetic things (the lone exceptions being Smash and Codename S.T.E.A.M.). And considering the content that the game has without it, I think people who don't want it enough to buy a figure can live without. I could. |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#16 Posted: 20:05:23 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: CAV
If Nintendo were smart, the Amiibo's should have had their own game ala Skylander's or Disney infinity. I'm not saying Amiibo's are dumb, they're an excellent business profit...but their are other ways that Amiibo's could be used rather than "muh locked in disc DLC". |
|
CAV
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6289
|
#17 Posted: 20:06:29 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
Because NeoGAF whines about everything. They've whined in the past about reviewers giving certain games an 8 or 9 instead of a perfect score. Quote:
5 maps compared to how many maps most TF2 games are played on? 5 maps really isn't that big of a problem if they're diverse enough. And considering that they're going to add more maps for free not long after launch shouldn't be that big of a problem. Don't buy it during launch. Fine. Wait until after many of the updates are put in. But stop acting like they're chopping the game up to sell you parts for cash or are trying to sell you a season pass when they aren't. Quote: zer0dch
I'd honestly rather have exclusive content in games from the figures rather than a full game based entirely around characters you need to buy (one of the biggest turn offs of Skylanders for me is that I need to buy them to play; amiibo are optional). |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 20:08:39 07/05/2015 by CAV
|
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#18 Posted: 20:50:41 07/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: Sesshomaru75
I think in this case whining is fine. The game is rushed and so not worth the full $60. @CAV I promise I'll respond to you, I am just in a hurry. |
|
Bionichute
Yellow Sparx
Gems: 1889
|
#19 Posted: 21:01:19 07/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
![[User Posted Image]](http://i.imgur.com/8T3W573.jpg) Keep it up man, you're losing a one sided war.
---
I'M A KAMEN RIDER //forum.darkspyro.net/spyro/viewposts.php?topic=129460 Check out my Skylanders game idea! |
CountMoneyBone
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5073
|
#20 Posted: 21:23:53 07/05/2015
this dont come as a shock ninendo are going crazy with the dlc for a while now, that we see with mario kart already. digital sales are high on nintendo game systems, so of course they are gonna exploit the situation. as long people is buying and dont vote with their wallets. you can expect to see more games that will have its content split up and sold as separate dlc. soon we wil also have microtransactions in the picture. i believe this is the start, people complain about ea,ubisoft,warner, you will see nintendo among them soon. it sure aint easy to be a gamer anymore, when your being flogged at every corner. i miss the days when you could walk into a shop and buy a game, while knowing you had bought the complete and finished game. no game bug fix patches or parts of the game sold as separate dlc.
---
Ha! HA, sage ich. |
|
sonicbrawler182
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 7105
|
#21 Posted: 21:30:03 07/05/2015
OK I know zer0dch can complain about little things at times, but I'm shocked people are saying he's in the wrong here.
Splatoon is not a complete game at launch. Not by any means. 5 maps is a tiny amount for a AAA shooter to have at launch. You know how many Star Wars Battlefront will have? Like, 12. And people are complaining about that, because it's a step down from previous games in that series. So of course complaining in the case of Splatoon is justified. The Amiibos are blatant nickel and diming. You don't lock basic weapon tutorials and bonus games behind a €15 pay wall. That's absurd. Not to mention the gear that's locked behind it will probably be rarer than the normal in game gear, and rare gear in this game is the best. Also the demo isn't a real demo, and you have to play it at a certain time. Guess what the first time for people in the UK is? 4-5AM. Yeah, 4AM is the latest I GO TO BED, not wake up. That demo should be playable at any time, like any other ****ing demo.
---
"My memories will be part of the sky." |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 21:31:06 07/05/2015 by sonicbrawler182
|
Skylanders fan
Emerald Sparx
Gems: 3952
|
#22 Posted: 21:42:24 07/05/2015
I think the idea of the amiibos are great
Splatton looks nice and great for all we know they could have just added this update becuse the popularity of the game maybe it was gonna have this amount anyways. Yeah the demo its sad its not able to be used all the time but its better than not haveing one.
---
Yep still around just not posting much anymore |
Seiki
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6150
|
#23 Posted: 22:21:26 07/05/2015
Sure, it doesn't sound like it's worth $60, and sure it doesn't sound great at launch, but with regular, free updates it will still be a good game overall, plus there's always store sales. You don't have to buy it at launch, it's easy to wait a bit until it drops closer to $40 before buying.
---
Once in my dreams, I rose and soared. No matter how I'm knocked around or beaten down, I will stand up restored. |
|
CAV
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6289
|
#24 Posted: 22:29:31 07/05/2015
^The question is, will the game actually lower in price? A lot of big Nintendo titles tend to not lower in price except for some sales from retailers.
Maybe it could lower if it doesn't perform well, but considering the hype surrounding it and how much Nintendo is pushing it, I have a hard time thinking it'll ever go under $50. |
|
sonicbrawler182
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 7105
|
#25 Posted: 22:55:42 07/05/2015
Quote: Seiki
And that's why Nintendo is shooting themselves in the foot. People think it isn't a great game at launch, so they don't buy it. So they wait a bit...then other games come out. So they buy those. Then other games come out. People buy those. Nintendo had the perfect release window for this game, but squandered it with all of this negative, hype draining news for the game.
---
"My memories will be part of the sky." |
|
Seiki
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6150
|
#26 Posted: 23:27:17 07/05/2015
Quote: CAV
True, many don't lower in overall price, but as you said, there's still retailer sales which one can take advantage of.
---
Once in my dreams, I rose and soared. No matter how I'm knocked around or beaten down, I will stand up restored. |
somePerson
Diamond Sparx
Gems: 8864
|
#27 Posted: 23:46:59 07/05/2015
This is why you buy the game after the price drop.
|
TacoMakerSkys
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5652
|
#28 Posted: 05:03:02 08/05/2015
Quote: sonicbrawler182
For once I agree with you. If Nintendo wanted to get people to actually play their game, regardless of having the demo, they would've done the timed multiplayer demo from the moment the demo released at 8AM PST today, until around 8PM PST Sunday. Like timed betas, it would've been the better option to attract more people, not to try and crash Nintendo's servers during the one hour. Incomplete and rushed is the only way to describe Splatoon before these tiny updates.
---
words. letters. filler. |
skylandersspyro
Emerald Sparx
Gems: 3872
|
#29 Posted: 14:07:17 08/05/2015
Quote: somePerson
This. anyway i cant wait for the demo
---
Uh Uh Uh! You didn't say the magic word! |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#30 Posted: 17:31:11 08/05/2015 | Topic Creator
"b-but there is DLC two/three months after the game comes out!!!! the game is good!"
yeah, so just wait until august and buy it for $20 used to buy the actual complete game |
|
CountMoneyBone
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5073
|
#31 Posted: 17:36:47 08/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
sadly nintendo wiiu games nearly never goes down in price like the ps and xbone games.. finding one game used at a bargain good luck..
---
Ha! HA, sage ich. |
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#32 Posted: 17:38:03 08/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: CountMoneyBone
I don't think Nintendo is in charge of how low a game goes in the used bin at GameStop. None of them go lower than $40 on consoles because they're generally good....however, this title doesn't seem like it will be all that good. I don't expect good reviews at all. |
|
CountMoneyBone
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5073
|
#33 Posted: 17:54:10 08/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
at my gamestop i still see nintendo wiiu games at full price that are 2-3 years old, and there is nearly none used, and when they are used the price is only a few dollars less than new so not worth it. if you want cheaper nintendo wiiu games you must look for deals online(amazon etc), i think that is the best. i for sure dont like this trend that nintendo is in now, they are going over board with the dlc. it wasnt long ago nintendo said no to dlc. if this keeps up i think i will only stick to the 3ds and just forget the wiiu(even when i planned to pick it up later on). it just shows nintendo is out of control when it comes to dlc, like with the mario kart game its a new dlc nearly every month.. nintendo never bother with releasing a goty or complete edition with everything on the disc.. so i am near the end where i start to give a f about them and their wiiu... dont get me wrong they release good games but this nickel and dime out everything with dlc, i am starting to get enough of.
---
Ha! HA, sage ich. |
|
CAV
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 6289
|
#34 Posted: 18:30:14 08/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
Quote: zer0dch
The game isn't likely to drop down in price even used. I don't expect it to ever get lower than $50 unless it tanks hard. And seeing how many people still want to buy the game at launch (see reddit) I think it will sell reasonably well at the start. Question is if people will still play after, and if people will buy later on. As for reviews, I expect a Metascore of 78. Content and missing features are going to drop the score down from the higher 80s it probably could've gotten otherwise, but if the mechanics and gameplay are good it's still going to get a positive response. |
pankakesparx456
Diamond Sparx
Gems: 7795
|
#35 Posted: 19:53:40 08/05/2015
Thank you Nintendo. You somehow managed to completely butcher what is arguably the most innovative new IP out there. I for one am not going to get this game after all that was announced. maybe when the price is lower and the game has all its dlc and patches, then just maybe i'll consider buying it.
It seems like Nintendo is a roller coaster with what they've been doing lately. last year they enjoyed success from Mario Kart 8, Bayonetta 2, Pokemon ORAS, and Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS. Now they have all of these problems with Splatoon on top of the amiibo problem and their YouTube program.
---
Cool cool. |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 19:54:11 08/05/2015 by pankakesparx456
|
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#36 Posted: 20:11:19 08/05/2015 | Topic Creator
Quote: pankakesparx456
At this point I'm not even buying it. Nintendo really screwed up here. |
|
CountMoneyBone
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5073
|
#37 Posted: 20:18:01 08/05/2015
Quote: pankakesparx456
i totally agree with you on this one... the sad thing is that some people will blindly buy anything nintendo without being critic of the quality... and we will just get more of the problems we have with splatoon. nintendos seal of quality is starting to fade.
---
Ha! HA, sage ich. |
|
pankakesparx456
Diamond Sparx
Gems: 7795
|
#38 Posted: 20:24:16 08/05/2015
If Splatoon doesn't do well(which judging by the amount of people criticizing it now, probably won't), that means all Nintendo has going for them is Star Fox, Yoshi's Woolly World, and Xenoblade Chronicles X this year. and we don't even have specific release dates for those games yet.
They need to step up their game. I love Nintendo, but they're losing fans by pulling stunts like this.
---
Cool cool. |
|
CountMoneyBone
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5073
|
#39 Posted: 21:09:39 08/05/2015
Quote: pankakesparx456
could you put the links here to other places where people are criticizing the game?
---
Ha! HA, sage ich. |
TTD
Hunter
Gems: 6394
|
#40 Posted: 21:29:29 08/05/2015
It is not an unfinished game, if you really want to see an unfinished game take a look at halo: the master chief collection or battlefield 4. The game is incredibly well polished with enough content to last for hours upon hours. When I played it back in September everything felt smooth and controlled great - and that was over half a year ago, the time that some developers spend on an entire game!
Quote: CountMoneyBone
Iwata has stated multiple times that nintendo will not go the route of the other companies and start incorporating Microtransactions in games that you pay for. Nintendo is really good with these kind of things, they are also not calling 'free to play' games 'free to play' instead, they are branding them as 'free to start'. Furthermore, nintendo does DLC right, what most companies do is make a game, take 20% of the game out and lock it behind a season pass or a DLC - what's even worse is that they do this day 1 of the game's release! Nintendo, on the other hand don't develop DLC often, they only come out with new mario kart DLC every few months which is of a high quality and at an affordable price. |
|
pankakesparx456
Diamond Sparx
Gems: 7795
|
#41 Posted: 21:32:25 08/05/2015
Quote: CountMoneyBone
this might take a minute. i read an article on Splatoon's direct and there were people tearing it up in the comments section but i can't find the article. EDIT: can't find the article. thought that was a bad generalization to make because on other places people still seem to be neutral on their thoughts on the game.
---
Cool cool. |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 21:45:01 08/05/2015 by pankakesparx456
|
| zer0dch Ripto Gems: 1916 |
#42 Posted: 22:07:05 08/05/2015 | Topic Creator
This game is very unfinished. It's practically a $60 beta
Forgot to mention theirs only 3 weapon types. 3 weapon types, 5 maps, 2 battle modes, tacked on single player missions, 3 mini games, tutorial locked through amiibo + even more, no mic chat, no friend lobbies, no customized matches Yeah, this game will be dropped so hard. Someone explain to me how they will have fun with this until August. A $60 game. 5. M. A. P. S. Jesus.... |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 22:29:24 08/05/2015 by zer0dch
|
|
skylandersspyro
Emerald Sparx
Gems: 3872
|
#43 Posted: 22:57:00 08/05/2015
Quote: zer0dch
SHUT UP WE get it!!!!!!
---
Uh Uh Uh! You didn't say the magic word! |
| Underian Emerald Sparx Gems: 3095 |
#44 Posted: 00:24:00 09/05/2015
ugggh
|
|
sonicbrawler182
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 7105
|
#45 Posted: 00:47:28 09/05/2015
Quote:
![[User Posted Image]](http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2015/04/splatoon-720x404.jpg) €15 a piece, the Squid is exclusive to the 3-pack in the US, and to a "Limited Edition Bundle" in Europe (the latter goes at odds with the Global Testfire Promotion).
---
"My memories will be part of the sky." |
|
TacoMakerSkys
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5652
|
#46 Posted: 02:41:54 09/05/2015
Quote: skylandersspyro
How about you shut up? You came to a topic expecting negativity, so why are you complaining about it? He has the full right to express his opinion on this, and if you don't like it, go back to whatever other thread you like.
---
words. letters. filler. |
| LunarDistortion Ripto Gems: 3606 |
#47 Posted: 05:06:35 09/05/2015
Quote: TacoMakerSkys
Now, I'm not going to condone what skylandersspyro said, as it was a sudden and unneeded outburst. However, I do believe zer0dch has made his points pretty clear by now. Before the posts that skylandersspyro replied to, I've counted 2 posts on the same page with to some extent the exact same message, one of them is the OP. I've seen this in other threads zer0dch has made too. Feel free to express your opinion, but I wouldn't repeat a similar message within such a short gap like that. It gets to the point where it feels a little spammy IMO. |
|
CountMoneyBone
Platinum Sparx
Gems: 5073
|
#48 Posted: 10:48:54 09/05/2015
Quote: TTD
nintendo have gone from this to this(in their own words).... seal of quality = we take the time and release finished games -> releasing unfinished games and day one patches to fix broken games we dont believe in dlc it will delude the game quality -> dlc for nearly every game we dont want to lessen the quality of our games -> mobile and microtransactions its clearly that nintendo is in decline. this is not for the players, this is only for their own wallets. also nintendo is a company that have not been in business financing problems after the the old wii. they earned so much money from the old wii, that they could stand a loss for 20 years before it made an impact on them. on top of this we have the digital only release thing going on, and nintendo is slowly turning into a digital rental service. i love nintendo and their games for many years, but things just dont feel the same anymore.
---
Ha! HA, sage ich. |
|
TTD
Hunter
Gems: 6394
|
#49 Posted: 12:17:02 09/05/2015
Quote: CountMoneyBone
1. Nintendo has never had day 1 patches to fix game breaking bugs (ie, terrible frame rate, poor matchmaking ect). Name 1 game developed by nintendo that has had game breaking bugs day 1. 2. Reasonable priced DLC and released after the games launch. 3. Nintendo games don't have Microtransactions (with the exeption of 'free to start' games). And mobile doesn't mean a decline of quality, they haven't even shown any mobile games yet so it isn't really fair to say that they are of a poor quality. |
Edited 1 time - Last edited at 12:37:36 09/05/2015 by TTD
|
Please login or register a forum account to post a message.
darkspyro
net