darkSpyro

I don't understand why people are saying TFB entries have superior story lines. IMO its all the same, very formulaic. The bad guys shows up, new sub-group of skylanders methodically thwart the baddy's plans. I haven't seen anything particularly ground breaking with the story telling in any of the games. The quality is consistently OK, for a younger audience.

I am not a fan of Kaos Mode. It feels a lot like the arena challenge in Swap Force were you are trying to stop monsters from getting the food pile (or cake... bad memory) in the middle. Except now there are waves and a turret. How new is that mode? they could have just thrown it in the arena challenges.

I think Swap Force was a much better game due to the variety. When you have 80+ figures, the volume of content really matters, otherwise, the large size of your collection stops being a positive. I have found myself being really unmotivated to play trap team because there just isn't much for my older skylanders to do.

In Swap Force, the levels were a bit long, and the puzzles were a bit easy. But I will take that over Trap Team, where most of the levels have felt barren of things to do or enemies to fight. Also, because of the way the swapping mechanic works, you really have to try to die in this game. It just hasn't been challenging.

I don't know much about development cycles, or how the labor was divided between VV and TFB and Beenox. So I won't comment on who is better. Instead I will say that after the original innovation in SSA, the subsequent innovation and iteration of game I have liked best was SF.

One thing that is like nails on a chalk board when playing STT is that it looks like the characters are speaking a whole different language when delivering dialog. It's like those cheesy old dubbed Kungfu movies, I thought they had engines that could match speech to mouth movement better than that. I don't think it was as bad for SSF.

Quote: Zylek

One thing that is like nails on a chalk board when playing STT is that it looks like the characters are speaking a whole different language when delivering dialog. It's like those cheesy old dubbed Kungfu movies, I thought they had engines that could match speech to mouth movement better than that. I don't think it was as bad for SSF.

It was practically the same.

Trap Team animations are more fluid and cartoon-ish, while SWAP Force's were more "realistic" and "rigid".

Quote: skylandersspyro

Beenox should do a PC version.. anyway on-topic VV should do better than TFB this time...

This. Seriously!

I've said this in another thread, but I really think its best to think of it as 2 series with the same theme, or, like, VV's games are an "offshoot" series. They each have their plusses and minuses, but it is disappointing that the differences are so noticeable...

For one thing, it seems like TfB's characters work better in TfB's games, and VV's in their game (and presumably in their next game). I noticed that many characters that were nerfed in Swap Force, like Tree Rex having his slam radius severely reduced, or Elementalist Vodood no longer getting a big boost to the AoE of his combo slam attack, were restored to their former glory in TT.

On the other hand, a lot of SF's characters don't work so well in TT without SF's physics engine to support them, like Wind-Up can't juggle like he used to, Stink Bomb's palm fist doesn't send enemies flying any more (even though it mentions it in the description of the move), Dune Bug's ball doesn't work on large enemies, etc.

So I've decided that in the future, I will only use VV's figures in VV's games, and TfB's figures in TfB's games, and think of them as just 2 different series in the same genre with some crossover characters. I prefer TfB's art style, overall whimsical charm, and greatly varied levels (of the proper length!), but VV has better physics in its combat system and offers a bunch more bonus content and more challenge.

Quote: Zauron

I've said this in another thread, but I really think its best to think of it as 2 series with the same theme, or, like, VV's games are an "offshoot" series. They each have their plusses and minuses, but it is disappointing that the differences are so noticeable...

For one thing, it seems like TfB's characters work better in TfB's games, and VV's in their game (and presumably in their next game). I noticed that many characters that were nerfed in Swap Force, like Tree Rex having his slam radius severely reduced, or Elementalist Vodood no longer getting a big boost to the AoE of his combo slam attack, were restored to their former glory in TT.

On the other hand, a lot of SF's characters don't work so well in TT without SF's physics engine to support them, like Wind-Up can't juggle like he used to, Stink Bomb's palm fist doesn't send enemies flying any more (even though it mentions it in the description of the move), Dune Bug's ball doesn't work on large enemies, etc.

So I've decided that in the future, I will only use VV's figures in VV's games, and TfB's figures in TfB's games, and think of them as just 2 different series in the same genre with some crossover characters. I prefer TfB's art style, overall whimsical charm, and greatly varied levels (of the proper length!), but VV has better physics in its combat system and offers a bunch more bonus content and more challenge.

I know what ya mean my friend. 's Dune Ball was the one thing he had going for him and now it doesn't work as well as it used to and really good theory there. I noticed that too with the different games and characters as well. Don't get me start with how bad was in Swap Force that was sad. Hopefully it will be different next time, but only time will tell if they do it right this time.

Quote: Zauron

I've said this in another thread, but I really think its best to think of it as 2 series with the same theme, or, like, VV's games are an "offshoot" series. They each have their plusses and minuses, but it is disappointing that the differences are so noticeable...

For one thing, it seems like TfB's characters work better in TfB's games, and VV's in their game (and presumably in their next game). I noticed that many characters that were nerfed in Swap Force, like Tree Rex having his slam radius severely reduced, or Elementalist Vodood no longer getting a big boost to the AoE of his combo slam attack, were restored to their former glory in TT.

On the other hand, a lot of SF's characters don't work so well in TT without SF's physics engine to support them, like Wind-Up can't juggle like he used to, Stink Bomb's palm fist doesn't send enemies flying any more (even though it mentions it in the description of the move), Dune Bug's ball doesn't work on large enemies, etc.

So I've decided that in the future, I will only use VV's figures in VV's games, and TfB's figures in TfB's games, and think of them as just 2 different series in the same genre with some crossover characters. I prefer TfB's art style, overall whimsical charm, and greatly varied levels (of the proper length!), but VV has better physics in its combat system and offers a bunch more bonus content and more challenge.

If we could just get TFB and VV working together on a game, then we'd probably have the perfect Skylanders game.

Quote: AdamGregory03

Quote: Zauron

I've said this in another thread, but I really think its best to think of it as 2 series with the same theme, or, like, VV's games are an "offshoot" series. They each have their plusses and minuses, but it is disappointing that the differences are so noticeable...

For one thing, it seems like TfB's characters work better in TfB's games, and VV's in their game (and presumably in their next game). I noticed that many characters that were nerfed in Swap Force, like Tree Rex having his slam radius severely reduced, or Elementalist Vodood no longer getting a big boost to the AoE of his combo slam attack, were restored to their former glory in TT.

On the other hand, a lot of SF's characters don't work so well in TT without SF's physics engine to support them, like Wind-Up can't juggle like he used to, Stink Bomb's palm fist doesn't send enemies flying any more (even though it mentions it in the description of the move), Dune Bug's ball doesn't work on large enemies, etc.

So I've decided that in the future, I will only use VV's figures in VV's games, and TfB's figures in TfB's games, and think of them as just 2 different series in the same genre with some crossover characters. I prefer TfB's art style, overall whimsical charm, and greatly varied levels (of the proper length!), but VV has better physics in its combat system and offers a bunch more bonus content and more challenge.

If we could just get TFB and VV working together on a game, then we'd probably have the perfect Skylanders game.

Totally! With any luck the next game will be a more collaborative effort with both developers contributing their strongest traits from either game.

Ideally, I'd put my vote down for a more basic game, a sort of All stars title, pretty sure someone else suggested that too.

Now, I'll start by saying I don't have TT yet. But from what I'm hearing about TT, I hope VV does the next one. One one hand I do have the urge to go and buy TT right away now that I'm playing the older Skylanders games again as well, but on the other hand...

It seems the series is heading ever more towards the "cash grab" trap. Of course admittedly VV kind of started this. After all in SSA you only needed 8 figures to open all gates and such. In SG you needed 9, since a single giant was enough to do the stuff requiring a Giant, and you got that giant when you got the game, with the booster pack you didn't even have to get any other figs and got off cheaper. Then in SSF you suddenly needed 8 swappers to get to and do the SWAP areas, and of course they were premium-priced figs (sadly I missed two cheap ones just now, one due to foolishness and one due to a malfunctioning online store - sad). Anyway, seems TfB overdid VV in this aspect this time around. Trap master only elemental gates? What the heck? And of course more expensive figs than cores again as well. And of course you also need traps. One for each element from my understanding to be able to use all the villains. That's a lot of money for the traps, and who even knows if they're usable in the next game.

Aside from that there seems to be the lack of additional gameplay modes in TT. Not only are many of those introduced by VV not making a return, but even heroic challenges of previous TfB games are gone. Whyyyyy? There are so many figures to play, never mind all the villains, that not giving the game plenty of content and modes to do seems kind of ridiculous. From what I hear even the adventure packs are lackluster, which is sad. I'm not sure what TfB was thinking here!

Then there's some madness going on with the character power levels from what I've read. Eon's Elite are silly in that aspect, but not alone in that regard. Also a lot of the time old characters are pretty pointless apparently, since you'll do better with the new Trap Masters. Also no level cap increase? Oh come on. I read it somewhere that they didn't increase it for balance reasons. What balance reasons? None of the Skylanders games have been all that balance, and somehow it seems TT the least of all.

SSF brought some good new things to the series, like the additional modes and jumping. Not being to jump felt like a pain in the other games, especially after playing SSF. Not being able to attack while jumping was a slight disappointment though, so it's good TfB at least improved on that.

I'm sure there are other things TT improves compared to SSF, but all things considered even though I want to get TT I feel like it's prudent to wait for it to go on sale at this point. I'd prefer the Dark Edition, but 99€ is too much given the expected replayability. I paid 75€ for SSF Dark Edition last Christmas, that'd be more acceptable at least.

So what I hope from VV in the next game is more stuff to do again, like in SF. In terms of levels etc I have no real preference between TfB's and VV's offerings, although admittedly shorter levels have their advantages, and my favorite level out of all the games (bar TT obviously, not having played it) is probably Wilikin village. Nor do I dislike VV's Skylanders or feel it's not a "Skylander-y game" like so many seem to think.

With all that said... how good is Prism Break in TT? Admittedly with the wow-pow he seemed perhaps too strong in SG, but in SSF he's woefully weak which made me quite sad.

Can some one tell me the difference between TfB's Skylanders and VV's Skylanders? With a few examples?

^ Off topic, but I wanna add you! My friend code is 2191-7661-4611. Already registered ya.

Onion dump

• Villains are a great idea and it's fun using/listening to them. Also, making them catachable is far more inventive than just turning them into figures and adds more to character choice with tagging.
  
• The environment variety is the best it's ever been, also hub is pretty good, but feels a bit empty and doesn't fit into the plot as well as the last ones (including SF's, which was arguably the best of the first 3 hubs, at least).
  
• TT's story is far superior to SF's- even with less background lore than past TFB games- because the stuff it contradicts, for the most part, isn't as noticeable and doesn't get in the way as much. SF's biggest example is the Illuminator plot hole- shown elves would lose hope and get invaded without it, it's taken away anyway and never acknowledged again, nor do we know it was returned. An entire level hinges on that. The biggest contradiction I can think of in TT is how villains are called Skylanders by NPCs- that's arguably worse since it happens if you play any of the dozens of villains, but at least I can't think of any equally big plot errors (SF has the pretty big Kaos Mom Portal plothole too) and the other contradictions I can think of are far more forgiveable than the villains thing. Also, TFB has a better mood, adding in more dark themes to levels and the story. Their characters and scenarios are generally better as well, they're more creative and are built up and fit together better.
  
• At the same time, TT's story is somewhat worse than TFB's past efforts (aside from the mood- they nailed that), with much less background lore and more unexplained things. It doesn't fit together quite as well as Giants.
  
• TT's lack of extra modes is unforgiveable with even PVP being gone. Doom Challenge doesn't feel that fresh (and the later levels are frustrating without a villain, deterring me from going through with just the Skylanders I like, which is something I wanted to do).
  
• In fact, that balance problem is evident in several parts of the game, especially boss battles. Doom Raiders are just frustrating to fight unless you use your villain or have a Trap Master. Like I said, deters me from playing through with some Skylanders I want to (not many of the characters I'm attached to are good in TT and I don't like many of the new ones, even after trying them- perhaps because of SF's physics disappearing). I can use villains for those tough segments, but they're so much better than my Skylanders it feels like a waste of time to fight with Skylanders, and I end up steamrolling things with Kaos as opposed to tagging- and that makes the game too easy (last levels of Kaos Mode aside).
  
• I miss SF's fighting physics.
  
• I miss SF's variety of modes.
  
• I miss SF's generally superior game design and various tweaks to make menus and stuff better.
  
• I miss Giants' easily skipped cutscenes. (TT's are better than SF's but not as good as Giants')
  
• I miss SA's immersion.
  
• I miss the older form of Story Scrolls.
  
• I miss being able to explore Gates with Core Skylanders I like. (I blame Acti for this.)
  
• I miss looking forward to PVP, where I would introduce my family to new Skylanders.

... Yes, I'm looking forward to VV's next game, provided extra modes and/or the SF physics are back so I can play as TT Skylanders with them.

Perhaps I'm unpleasable, but I just feel like I already had a fill of Skylanders and TT didn't offer that much. I still like it, but it's my clear least favourite and I think it's worst objectively. At least with SF, I felt like it added more to the franchise, even with all my little nitpicks (many of which still bug me... But have continued into TT or been inadequately resolved).

I won't elaborate on these after I finish my review of the game and I don't want to drone on about these points like I did with my SF nitpicks (the point about SF's better game design aside, perhaps). It's not because of bias toward TFB, but because doing that wasn't fun. I feel like it ruined SF for me.

For the record, I think objectively:
SF > SA > Giants > TT

Personally:
Giants (nostalgia is a powerful thing) > SF = SA > TT

Fought almost every Doom Raider with Cores (Blades, Chopper and Food Fight).
They are not frustrating, without using a Trap Master or a villain.

Also, just because villains are stronger, doesn't mean you have to use them instead of the Skylanders, if it makes the game boring and ripetitive. It's a choice, sure, and you can do it, but the objective of the game is not "rush to the end as fast as possible" (unless you want to beat the timer ).

You should enjoy a game, not finish it quickly like it was a chore.

Take your time.

Of course, that's just a personal opinion, but I think no one should play a game, or even a single level, just for the sake of finishing it.

^ I expected a "you don't have to use the villains" response.

Thing is, I like to push myself to the limit. If the game provides me with a clearly superior character, I will use them to get through the most frustrating segments that I feel I couldn't reasonably beat with others. In TT's case, there are numerous times where I felt that way.
Many of the easier chapters where I don't feel forced to use a strong villain provide little gold and the Doom Challenge and Arena Battles just don't hold my interest, with all the times where you need to watch cutscenes or wait for enemies to spawn. It's just worse combat than SF without the same physics and not many new characters interested me, gameplay-wise (Blades is the only one that grabbed me and stuck his claws in ). Also, there aren't many enemies that spawn on and attack from higher platforms (absolutely NONE in Kaos Mode because all the arenas there are flat), which was one of the most interesting/challenging parts of SF's game design.

And I seriously disagree about the bosses or 500+HP enemies not being frustrating, at least the later ones, which feel like a grind with many Skylanders. Could I beat those enemies with most of the Skylanders? Yeah, but it's not fun; it feels like I'm hitting them for naught when I've dealt hundreds of damage and they still aren't down- and without SF's physics, attacking them feels more repetitive than strategic.

I want to use my favourite character against a Doom Raider, Sprocket? Oh, but the later bosses hardly give her a chance to use her melee attacks and her mines are weak and they just destroy her turrets (which miss a lot anyway) in one hit. :/ A lot of melee characters are screwed against them.

Even with Trap Masters, I felt very frustrated when fighting against some of the Doom Raiders (Dr. Krankcase and Kaos especially, Wolfgang was also kinda annoying but at least I dealt with him relatively fast and his arena was more interesting). Golden Queen was the only Doom Raider in the last half who didn't frustrate me, but I remember using Snap Shot against her, which probably had something to do with it...

I think it's worthwhile to point out in this thread that, on average across Skylanders fans, Swap Force is the least favorite Skylanders game, compared to the other three. That's not to say that Swap Force doesn't have fans, because there are definitely SOME fans that feel Swap Force is the best Skylanders game ... but those fans are a minority.

On average, across the board, Spyro's Adventure and Trap Team are the preferred games, at least based on the (admittedly non-scientific) data from this other thread:

//forum.darkspyro.net/spyro/viewposts.php?topic=109768

So, I guess my point is that while Swap Force (and vicariously .... Vicarious Visions) has a niche following, the overall community isn't in favor of the alterations that VV inserted into the franchise. If VV is "taking point" on the next Skylanders release (which seems to be the belief in the community here), then ... to answer the OP's question: no, I don't think the majority of fans are "excited about what VV has in store for Skylanders 5".

Quote: Drek95

Also, just because villains are stronger, doesn't mean you have to use them instead of the Skylanders, if it makes the game boring and ripetitive. It's a choice, sure, and you can do it, but the objective of the game is not "rush to the end as fast as possible" (unless you want to beat the timer ).

I'm of the opinion that if I have to self impose rules in order to make the game more challenging / enjoyable, that is indicative of poor game design.

Quote: Arc of Archives

^ I expected a "you don't have to use the villains" response.

Thing is, I like to push myself to the limit. If the game provides me with a clearly superior character, I will use them to get through the most frustrating segments that I feel I couldn't reasonably beat with others. In TT's case, there are numerous times where I felt that way.
Many of the easier chapters where I don't feel forced to use a strong villain provide little gold and the Doom Challenge and Arena Battles just don't hold my interest, with all the times where you need to watch cutscenes or wait for enemies to spawn. It's just worse combat than SF without the same physics and not many new characters interested me, gameplay-wise (Blades is the only one that grabbed me and stuck his claws in ). Also, there aren't many enemies that spawn on and attack from higher platforms (absolutely NONE in Kaos Mode because all the arenas there are flat), which was one of the most interesting/challenging parts of SF's game design.

And I seriously disagree about the bosses or 500+HP enemies not being frustrating, at least the later ones, which feel like a grind with many Skylanders. Could I beat those enemies with most of the Skylanders? Yeah, but it's not fun; it feels like I'm hitting them for naught when I've dealt hundreds of damage and they still aren't down- and without SF's physics, attacking them feels more repetitive than strategic.

I want to use my favourite character against a Doom Raider, Sprocket? Oh, but the later bosses hardly give her a chance to use her melee attacks and her mines are weak and they just destroy her turrets (which miss a lot anyway) in one hit. :/ A lot of melee characters are screwed against them.

Even with Trap Masters, I felt very frustrated when fighting against some of the Doom Raiders (Dr. Krankcase and Kaos especially, Wolfgang was also kinda annoying but at least I dealt with him relatively fast and his arena was more interesting). Golden Queen was the only Doom Raider in the last half who didn't frustrate me, but I remember using Snap Shot against her, which probably had something to do with it...

What can I say... I don't agree with you, but I understand your point of view, and all the observations you made are really clear.

Maybe you are playing at a higher difficulty level than mine, or maybe your characters aren't maxed out... Don't know.

Thanks for the reply, however, I really love Blades too (and wasn't expecting it, at least not that much).

vicarious visions will save the series.

BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADESSSSSSSSS Why did i do that? BECAUSE BLADES IT THE BESSTTT! Anyway I hope in Skylanders 5 (This better happen because if it doesn't it wont make any sense) That since Kaos has went over to the good side, Glumshanks wants revenge on the Skylanders for taking his master. So he then takes all the possible things that Kaos had to make him look eviler. Then he becomes looking like the Evilied Glumshanks once again (Evilied Crystals could come back) So then hes ready to take down the skylanders. By the way the only thing that wont make sense is if Kaos comes back for revenge. HES IN A TRAP he wont be able to get out.. I think...

Quote: Luminous35

BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADESSSSSSSSS Why did i do that? BECAUSE BLADES IT THE BESSTTT! Anyway I hope in Skylanders 5 (This better happen because if it doesn't it wont make any sense) That since Kaos has went over to the good side, Glumshanks wants revenge on the Skylanders for taking his master. So he then takes all the possible things that Kaos had to make him look eviler. Then he becomes looking like the Evilied Glumshanks once again (Evilied Crystals could come back) So then hes ready to take down the skylanders. By the way the only thing that wont make sense is if Kaos comes back for revenge. HES IN A TRAP he wont be able to get out.. I think...

I doubt it'll be revenge. Glumshanks doesn't seem like that. I honestly think he doesn't like Kaos, just stays with him because he has no where else to go. If he is the villain, it'll be on his own terms.

Quote: Luminous35

BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADES BLADESSSSSSSSS Why did i do that? BECAUSE BLADES IT THE BESSTTT! Anyway I hope in Skylanders 5 (This better happen because if it doesn't it wont make any sense) That since Kaos has went over to the good side, Glumshanks wants revenge on the Skylanders for taking his master. So he then takes all the possible things that Kaos had to make him look eviler. Then he becomes looking like the Evilied Glumshanks once again (Evilied Crystals could come back) So then hes ready to take down the skylanders. By the way the only thing that wont make sense is if Kaos comes back for revenge. HES IN A TRAP he wont be able to get out.. I think...

I think most likely scenario would be they bring in a new bad guy to fill in Kaos' shoes. Or they come up with some nonsensical excuse of how he can be in a trap and the main villain at the same time.

Quote: Drek95

What can I say... I don't agree with you, but I understand your point of view, and all the observations you made are really clear.

Maybe you are playing at a higher difficulty level than mine, or maybe your characters aren't maxed out... Don't know.

Thanks for the reply, however, I really love Blades too (and wasn't expecting it, at least not that much).

I'm glad we can agree to disagree! Keep up the nettiquite, good sir!



I was surprised by Blades too.

Quote: Arc of Archives

Quote: Drek95

What can I say... I don't agree with you, but I understand your point of view, and all the observations you made are really clear.

Maybe you are playing at a higher difficulty level than mine, or maybe your characters aren't maxed out... Don't know.

Thanks for the reply, however, I really love Blades too (and wasn't expecting it, at least not that much).

I'm glad we can agree to disagree! Keep up the nettiquite, good sir!



I was surprised by Blades too.

No problem! Looking forward to share my opinion with you again, my friend!

*insert Boris the Animal meme here*

All i want for the new game are the following:

1. NO S2 S3 OR S4 CHARACTERS (s2 is ok and they could always make other characters into minis)

2. Double jumping! Come on you have it on 3ds version why not the console!?

3. NO NEW PORTAL! keep the new one as i don't want to be overstocked with my portals (Got all of them from SA to TT)

And finally.....

4. More trappable villains along with the new gimmick.

Lets hope some of these are included in the 5th game.

TFB is better because it give sky landers something I can't even describe it luring us toward the game while vv just wants this whole new franchise also TFB has gifted us with blackout the most awesome dragon in the history of the universe

I think that they will have malefore or vathek or any dark dragon to pwn with blackout

Honestly, I want Heroics, quests and even PVP back. Granted, I didn't do too much PVP, but for the few times I would I enjoyed it. The fact that Heroics are gone is ridiculous. They could have had the bonus missions in SF become the new heroics. Certain missions give certain boosts. With their being less heroics, the boosts from the legendary treasures and charms would have been far more noticeable. I probably would have been much less insulted by the only speed charm adding a +1. And while I'm on that, they need to be less stingy with speed boosts. Some of us don't enjoy slow lumbering characters.

Anyway, at least heroics, quests and PVP gave me reasons to keep going long after story mode was conquered. It also gave me a reason to buy more characters, which I don't have anymore.