darkSpyro

Typhoon Titan has to be low on the Giants list. Damage less than 30 per hit is totally wimpy now, and nothing he does ticks fast enough to prove that statement wrong. In fact, Lightning Rod isn't good anymore. He just can't attack or defend well enough to compete with the new top characters, or the previous top characters in the A tier either for that matter. Even B-tier might be generous for him until we see what his Wow Pow does for ourselves.

But that is the problem: H honestly doesn't really maintain skill when fighting ranged characters. Since the only close-ranged characters in the E tier are Boomer and Stump Smash, he would most likely be unable to beat enough of the E tier characters to upgrade his rank.
Also, the Bounce Pad thing doesn't really apply to most arenas. Besides, apart from some luck from a bounce pad or something, he will most likely be unable to properly approach an opponent.

Okay well I dont know about you but he has great skill fighting ranged AND melee guys FOR ME. If you want to see a more in depth amalysis of tt then search "Lightning rod in depth review, there is one on gamesot that I found very helpful.

Several fights this evening between Double Trouble Channeler S1 and varying Giants and switching players and such. To an early statement, the lock on of Double Troubles Beam is a huge problem for slow Giants. Only Swarm had any chance of actually winning the battle and that only happened once. Although I cannot comment on his ranking versus other S2 Skylanders, I would give him a G ranking for effectiveness against Giants.

That is rather odd. I would think that DT's low speed would allow the Giants to effectively destroy him.

Quote: Bean Sprout

That is rather odd. I would think that DT's low speed would allow the Giants to effectively destroy him.

The Arenas in Giants are different in that effectively "avoiding" someone is not that difficult if you are focused on it. The problem is most Skylanders cannot damage while avoiding them, but Double Trouble can do significant damage while doing so. The biggest issue we ran in to is that non of the Giants have a significant enough DPS stopper or Gap Closer (although Tree Rex cane close it just want's enough). And thus, DT could lock on enough times and then just focus on running ...

Hmm... Interesting. Thank you for the data!

is awesome, both games. cynder and chop chop are his only weakness in giants. he is able to efectively destroy all our skylanders except them, with my little brother playing as him. terrafin is a 50/50

Quote: Thumpterra12

is awesome, both games. cynder and chop chop are his only weakness in giants. he is able to efectively destroy all our skylanders except them, with my little brother playing as him. terrafin is a 50/50

This is series 2 chop chop with the mega shield bash right?

actually, no. the series 1 chop chop is very good too.you can spam his AAB attack (on the xbox)
and it is like a dash.his shield can stop the eldrich beam too.

Double Trouble does have weaknesses. He's a slow, mid-range character with minimal defensive ability against ranged attack, and there are a lot of Skylanders built to destroy that now. I know a lot of results are against S1 characters, and that's okay, but it's the reposes that make me question keeping him in S-tier, especially considering that his own Wow Pow is so ineffectual in PVP. That, and Tech is a massively improved element this time, with even S2 Trigger Happy posing a serious threat to him by virtue of elemental strength.

Going along with what your saying Tashiji, It seems that Tech is a lot better then previously. Life, which used to be the best element has gone down a little bit. Right now I think Earth is the best element right now, each character is competitive enough to beat any top tier character.

I have reset my Fright Rider, and after some PvP will report my findings with him. I also want to countinue my testing on Jet Vac on bird blaster. I really think he could go up a tier. So to test this I will have him go against the following characters.

Cynder Nether Wielder S2
Fright Rider Joust Jockey
Spyro Sheep Burner

Right now I have beat Prism Break Crystaleer, and Trigger Happy Golden Frenzy. I have lost to Tree Rex with him. Dino Rang also beat Drobot, which makes me concerned about Drobots nerfs. Before Giants, I could not beat him. His lasers were too powerful. Now that they've been nerfed, others have a better shot at beating him. I want to countinue this by getting DS, and seeing who is the hit and run king.

i will get one of the following:s2 drill sgt, s2 hex, or hot head, who i will pick the oil path for. which should i get you havent tested yet?

Quote: Thumpterra12

i will get one of the following:s2 drill sgt, s2 hex, or hot head, who i will pick the oil path for. which should i get you havent tested yet?

You get who you want, I have neither right now. I expand my collection very slowly and only get the ones I want. I'm not really a completist. DS is next on my list along with Thumpback.

i usually want the ones i like, but ive heard good things about hex and DS, so i thought i might get him. thumpback is my favorite, but hot head is my 3rd fav, and i dont feel like waiting 25 days to get thumpback, so ill go with hot head.

Quote: Tashiji

Double Trouble does have weaknesses. He's a slow, mid-range character with minimal defensive ability against ranged attack, and there are a lot of Skylanders built to destroy that now. I know a lot of results are against S1 characters, and that's okay, but it's the reposes that make me question keeping him in S-tier, especially considering that his own Wow Pow is so ineffectual in PVP. That, and Tech is a massively improved element this time, with even S2 Trigger Happy posing a serious threat to him by virtue of elemental strength.

The characters in G tier have their weaknesses TOO though. If Ignitor is not careful his inanimate plied of armorial can get slaughtered. Flameslinger dies at the hands of both Glacier yeti and blizzard brawler slam bam. Drill sergant has pretty crappy damage and if someone gets behind Hex bone wall she is almost if not completely screwed. While I think that these characters are still powerful no character is without a weakness.

Yes, but they have very few weaknesses. There's a select character or two who will usually beat the S-rankers because of a playstyle strength, but for the most part, they cover their elemental weaknesses well. Most Water characters can't beat the top-tier Fires, most Life characters can't take out Hex, and good luck beating S2 Bash or Terrafin with a single one of their supposed Air weaknesses. Even Undeads, as buff as the element is now, are anything but a sure win against S2 Stump due to just how cheap he is. I do like Double Trouble, but I'm adjusting my vision of tiers a bit based on some of the new Wow Pows, and S-Rank really has to mean abnormally special in some way given the severity of the competition. DT is good, but he's not severely special anymore, because a Magic Bomb combo isn't the best or easiest spike damage like it was in S:SA, and ranged/defensive attackers have gotten better.

Really though, A-tier isn't bad now. A-tier is getting a bit rarefied itself. I'm not saying a character is useless because they go in the A-tier... I use A-tier characters. They compete rather well with S-tier, and have plenty of situational strengths. They just have more weaknesses overall to the whole roster than the few at the top. S2 Slam Bam might be a good bet against the top-tier Fires, but he doesn't exactly dominate the rest of the field that way. Ignitor, weak to Slam Bam though he may be, effortlessly fries pretty much everyone but his fellow S-tiers, and that includes non-Slam Bam Water characters.

So, I don't know. DT still has plenty of strengths, but I personally feel the metagame has changed too much, and favors strategy far more so than the previous game. Magic Bombs and Eldritch Beams are still the "instant win" button they used to be against plenty of characters, but the competition is way stiffer now.

EDIT: And please don't move DT based on what I'm saying alone, we still need to test more. His superiority just isn't as apparent this time as it was before, and more play is necessary.

Double Trouble can also effortlessly obliterate most characters. Its simple just lock on with your murderer beam and you'll have your enemy losing hundreds of HP before you know it. There are very few glaring counters to him. Some characters he is quite arena dependant when fighting(floral defender zook) Obviously we have different testing results where as we both find a different amount of counters to Double Trouble.

But on the topic of him being a giants killer...I'm glad you did some testing Slivers. These results as well as mine do support him being a giant killer. We can also start making predictions about how Double Trouble and the current G tier will fair against the giants who have yet to come out. I'm guessing thumpback will be difficult for Double Trouble Ignitor and flameslinger. Eye brawl will probably not be too hard for Double Trouble he might pose a threat for Ignitor and I'm guessing he will be hard for flameslinger. And as for Ninjini she probably will be varying.

Thumbtack looks like he will beat double trouble, because his anchor had a longer reach than any of s attacks. Ninjini looks like short range, so she will probably destroyed, and eye brawl can shoot out his eye and hunt DT down. Eye brawls melee attacks look like they propel him WAAY forward, but I don't know.

We don't know much about him yet. Lets focus on the guys out right now.

Quote: Thumpterra12

Thumbtack looks like he will beat double trouble, because his anchor had a longer reach than any of s attacks. Ninjini looks like short range, so she will probably destroyed, and eye brawl can shoot out his eye and hunt DT down. Eye brawls melee attacks look like they propel him WAAY forward, but I don't know.

For the eye brawl thing DT will probably have no problem mainly because magic>undead.

Oh yeah... Forgot about that. We don't know how much life any of them will have, so anything could happen

Ok, one of my Skylanders pals came over today, so I was able to do some testing. HOWEVER: That person was quite a bit younger than I am, and he cries when he doesn't get his way, o I wasn't completely able to test the Skylanders we needed testing on the most. But here are my results:

Stealth Elf (Pook Blade Saint) vs. Jet Vac (Bird Blaster): Stealth Elf won easily. Jet Vac's flying wasn't able to allow him to escape in the slightest. The vacuum proved to be quite useless in the match.

Lightning Rod (Lightning Lord) vs. Ignitor (Soul of the Flame): Ignitor won by a lot. Although the Grand Lightning was able to hinder Ignitor, once he got a few mortars in on the slow fellow the matchh was over.

Stealth Elf (Pook Blade Saint) vs. Chill (The Ice Block Path): SE won, but that was quite predictable. What I found out was that when SE froze due to her destroying the Ice Blocks. she was hindered quite a bit. It actually takes a bit of time to shatter the ice block, and Chill was able to get some good hits in with the ice bashing.

Drobot (Master Blaster) vs. Wham Shell (Captain Crustacean): Drobot was victorious. However, I found myself having to spend some time escaping from Wham Shell's Poseidon Strike quite a bit. I definitely noticed some subtle nerfs with Drobot.

Zook (Floral Defender) vs. Flameslinger (Pyromancer): Zook was able to beat Flameslinger. I had some trouble getting around the arena obstacles with Zook, though. Sometimes I wished that the mortar had a longer range. Still, the damage the MIRV mortars and the cacti were able to do was outstanding.

Swarm (The Flying/Stinger Path) vs. Tree Rex (Lumbering Laser): Tree Rex one, but it was close. The charged photosynthesis cannon wasn't able to hit Swarm, as the wasp was able to navigate around the field quickly while shooting the stingers at the tree. What allowed Tree Rex the victory was the charged mace arm smash attack. That attack, which is easy to charge, has fantastic range! The attack hit Swarm, even though he wa well away from Tree Rex.

Anyway, I do not have any specific recommendations with these results. These should only be used as some extra data.

We definitely are getting different results with DT, and I assume others. There are a variety of factors for this, but my first guess, and the easiest explanation, is Heroic Challenges. Especially elemental power if we're talking Tech v. Magic, etc., as those make a huge difference in who will win, as well as how the fight will go. There are plenty of factors that would explain why things seem different for two people playing the same matchup.

I heard that Stump smash wow pow makes him pretty broken especially on nut crafted. Can you just win an entire round against characters(in general) by spamming acorns?

Quote: Soopa Koopa

People played with him right?... We didn't just stick him at the bottom from lack of information...right?

... No.
Lightning Rod was placed where he was based on the research and opinions people threw in about him during Spyro's Adventure. There was an overwhelming opinion that he was a low-tier character despite his advantages. So far it doesn't look like anything will change for him in Giants until we hear more about his Wow Pow.
In the event of a "lack of information" about a character in this thread, we just don't place them in a tier at all.


Quote: Tashiji

EDIT: And please don't move DT based on what I'm saying alone, we still need to test more. His superiority just isn't as apparent this time as it was before, and more play is necessary.

I wasn't going to, don't worry. The opinions of Double Trouble being S Tier are still too overwhelming for now, so I won't be moving him until more of the rest of the tier list takes shape.


Quote: Bean Sprout

Anyway, I do not have any specific recommendations with these results. These should only be used as some extra data.

Any data is apreciated here, so thank you!


For now I think I can mark down Double Trouble / Chaneller as a Giant Killer until more developments arise.
Any other thoughts on me knocking down Spyro or Prism Break / Crystaleer?

• Double Trouble / Chaneller (both series) marked (G) for Giant Killer, until more research is made.
  

Out of curiosity, are Cynder and Prism Break's Wow Pows anything to know about?

I have absolutely no problem with Crystaleer and spyro being demoted a tier. Especially spyro hes pretty much reliant on one attack both ways you upgrade him and I find that he loses more than half of his matches.

I agree with moving down both. Spyro has lost every match so far, with four people using him. His attacks just aren't powerful enough. His fireballs don't do enough damage. He can charge but then he guts stuck in melee, and range characters annihilate him.

I also agree with moving down Prism break. No one could beat him in S:SA, except ignitor, and Sonic Boom. He just kicked everyone's butt. All you had to do was surround yourself with crystals, and when enemies got close, use that crystal smash. Now, I can beat him with anyone. His nerfs really hurt him in this one. He is still good, but not great.

Then Blitz needs to be moved down one as well. If I'm totally honest, the only reason I would have kept him in the middle tier, even in SA, was because of the damage the Ibex can deal in one hit, but now that's comparatively low to most other stuff because his playstyle has always been so ineffective. The Stun also seems to be glitched now which ruins the main point of the path.

I think (G) is becoming a moot point. If you are good, you are also good against the giants. The giants look like they will mostly fall in the a and b tiers, so if you are in s tier, of course you will neat them. I'm not so sure it is really needed.

Treefolk Charger... Is he good enough for S Tier? His dash is very quick and does 35 damage a tick, and then you can slam down with it for about 70. Plus, the shockwave and slam are still as good as ever, and Woodpecker Buddy actually has reliable AI. Treefolk Tripleshot is still a decent ranged option too. I haven't tried him in actual Battle yet but his damage numbers are so high and go together so well I don't think it's fair to put him under that spot in any way once you consider that combined with the fact he's a dashing Giant.

Let's give DS S2/Battledozer a bump up to D. He is winning 90%+ against the E tier with the addition of the future blaster. I don't see anything in D that would cause me to believe he wouldn't be more then competitive. Most of the same strategies you would use with Megadozer still can work with Battledozer just gimped, and if you are fighting another joister, you can always just bolt away and attempt to win with just the rockets. It works decently enough, most certainly against the bottomfeeders.

I don't know if Treefolk Charger is OP/Broken to justify S tier. He doesn't have anything like Hex's mega damage wow pow, Terrafin's invincibility while able to damage, Drill sergeant's ability to lay down solid damage while running away, Dino-rangs ability to blast melee at range and close in on shooters with phenomenal success in both areas. I don't even know if all the current S tier will stay there. He's great, I just don't feel he is broken or overpowered to give him an unfair advantage in a fight, thus shouldn't be in the S bracket

Quote: Mrmorrises

I heard that Stump smash wow pow makes him pretty broken especially on nut crafted. Can you just win an entire round against characters(in general) by spamming acorns?

Yup. Works against almost every character. Just be sure to put a Meganut in front of yourself to block projectiles, and remember that you can rotate your aim mid-Wow Pow to catch escapes.

And I agree on Battledozer. He may even reach the C-tier before all is said and done, because Future Blaster + escape tactics is just such a cheap combo.

Also, Smash & Bash S2 has got to be A-tier for the same reason Battledozer needs a raise. His Wow Pow is just plain effective, and even if it's gimped (in this case by lack of pollen plume), it's still better than what the majority of other Skylanders can do. He's inferior, but Smash & Bash S2 is still very good.

I wouldn't be against that move, Earth Dragon. Although the lasers aren't nearly as usable as Megadozer's, They can still help him secure a victory. Otherwise he can just spam MIRV rockets, while drilling to escape. The only few i would see him having a problem with in E tier would be Stump Smash and possibly Gill and Trig, with the former being more capable of damage and having more health, and the latter being viable projectile-wise.

Quote:

I don't even know if all the current S tier will stay there.

That's what I was thinking- the Giants just throw it waaaay out of whack.
I also updated the Tier Clarifications thread. If anyone has notes about Giants to contribute to that, they would be really appreciated.

Quote: Nibelilt

Quote:

I don't even know if all the current S tier will stay there.

That's what I was thinking- the Giants just throw it waaaay out of whack.

Third this. To actually be competitive in the S-tier, you need specialization, and it needs to be powerful enough to either outright destroy another character, ward them indefinitely, or outspeed and snipe them down. Average damage is no longer sufficient, and average tactics, such as just running in and punching something, or staying put and shooting something, are not effective against the best characters anymore. There is a lot more strategy involved, and to even compete, your character has to be powerful enough to deserve a specific counter. Like how you'll want a specialist onhand to stop your opponent from Hex-stomping your whole party, etc. Most of the S-tier characters do have this quality, but I feel there are still a couple who can be beaten generally (meaning, with characters pulled from the field) instead of specifically (by one or two others, maybe less), and that's a problem if we're trying to be accurate about who the best characters are.

These are my thoughts on S Tier currently...

Double Trouble / Channeler (G) Rarely use him in PVP but I think the consensus is he's likely to stay, at least until more Wow POWs are tested.
Double Trouble Sn2 / Channeler (G) Same as above
Stump Smash S2 / Nut Crafter Don't have
Zook / Floral Defender I'm not sure on moving him. Giants can just kill his cacti, and most upper tier characters outrun them now. It honestly might be worth consideration moving him to A.
Zook S2 / Floral Defender Same as above
Terrafin S2 / Sandhog Not moving for a looooooong time.
Terrafin S2 / Brawler Same as above
Bash S2 / Granite Dragon Don't have
Dino-Rang / Grand Boomerang Master Definetly time to move down to A, I think. His damage just isn't that high compared to the rest of the tier, and he's beaten by most long range characters now.
Crusher / Rock Grinder Haven't played
Crusher / Rubble Master Upgrading, haven't played in PVP
Hex S2 / Bone Crafter (G) Don't have
Ignitor / Soul of the Flame (G) Unlikely.
Ignitor S2 / Soul of the Flame (G) Nope.
Flameslinger S2 / Pyromancer (G) Don't have
Drill Sergeant S2 / Megadozer (G) Don't have

Can someone explain why joust jockey is one tier above sir lance a lot? I'm trying to decide on Fright riders path for pvp both of them look good.

Mainly because Joust Jockey gets a speed boost on the Jousting Charge, it's precious. It's not especially fast on Sir Lance A Lot- Joust Jockey outruns or matches a good part of the game with his, but Sir Lance A Lot's just matches faster walking speeds.

They are close, but I feel that Joust Jockey has more reliable sources of damage. You can get some good hits with Lance A lot, but the jousting is just easier to work with. Besides, with Fright Rider's low HP, it is crucial for him to have a viable escape move. Also, the combos that he can do while dashing are great. The 360 combo is quite useful. It does as much as a melee attack, and it hits from 2 to 4 times per attack. You can get some good damage in while hit the opponent with the dash, then ending it with the 360 move. The other combo is quite difficult to pull off, but it does 126 damage! Still, you would only really use this of you know your opponent won't dodge it.
Lance A lot has good combos, too. But the base damage of the melee attack isn't really high enough for A, and he just has too low HP to be a fully successful meleeist.

Fright rider is a Knight with a spear......why would you NOT joust with him?

Pop Fizz/Potion guy (sorry. Path title is slippin my mind) B tier. He's solid, but as lobbers tend to go, he has problems against any solid competition. Most of the A tier wod just tear him up. For example: Wham-Shell's posieden strike is effective in the exact area pop fizz wants to be against melee fighters and he'll get smoke if he closes in by the mace. He backs off, he gets starred. Voodood is Voodoo. He closes the distance, the rest is History. Drobot is Drobot. He says at distance and the rest is History. B is where he fits.

Pop Fizz/Beast Within' is a C tier guy. Not sure how he was placed in B, but he is only an all right melee guy. The main reason.....YOU HAVE TO TURN IT ON!! The fact you aren't in defacto go mode causes you to be at a slight disadvantage. Does he have tricks.....sure. But so does Gill Grunt and Jet-Vac. Unless there is something I missed like he is immune to stun like Voodood or slow like Sonic Boom, he is flawed and it makes him just average. When playing him, you spend a lot of time throwin potions anyway, just to a less effective result.

Drobot needs to be moved back to S.
Hardly anything can stand a chance agianst him on Master Blaster.
The best Long range in the game.

I also say that Slam Bam Glacier yeti SHould be moved to B.
Its a good slow down and a spam killer.

Quote: zap18

Drobot needs to be moved back to S.
Hardly anything can stand a chance agianst him on Master Blaster.
The best Long range in the game.

I disagree, especially since his rof has decreased, his lasers are thinner, and they don't home instantly. I have beat him with Dino Rang, and sonic boom. What really hurts him is that the new maps have different levels and range attacks always goes down. Wheel of power is a nightmare for range guys.

• Spyro / (both paths and series) moved to D Tier.
  
• Prism Break / Crystaleer (both series) moved to C Tier.
  
• Drill Sergeant S2 / Battledozer moved to D Tier.
  
• Stump Smash S2 / Smash 'n Bash moved to A Tier.
  
• Pop Fizz / Best of the Beast moved to C Tier.
  

I'll think about changing up the S Tier tommorow when I have more time.

One of my dorm friends loves the gimmick of this series, and I bet once next weekend comes around we will have time to play. That said, she doesn't do video games very often, so I'm hoping to see where Flashwing, Swarm, and Chill down the Ice Lancer path fall into, tier-wise.

Swarm is awesome at pvp^

I think we can all conclude Treefolk Charger is at least A from the thoughts scattered on this page, so until further assessment against B, A and S, I would put him there.

^i'll concur. Hit point sink, range supplement, decent damage....if he does get knocked down, he take a few current residents with him.

I chose Lumbering Laserer, so I don't know about that path, but it looks great. It looks like the only reason it isn't in S tier is the fact that he is just well-rounded, and doesn't have a specific spammable move.