darkSpyro

Simple story, yes, but also BAD.

I mean, compare Spyro 1 to SMB, and Spyro 2 to SMB2...

I don't see what's so bad about it.... Inspiration isn't always bad when done correctly. Dragons trapped in crystal, need to be rescued. Doesn't sound like a bad story, just a simple one.

How is a simple story bad? Look at other games of the time.
Crash Bandicoot was simple. Cortex steals gems, Crash wakes up from nap, etc...

I never said simple stories were bad....just look at LBP2's story....but every Classic Spyro game except YotD was both simple AND bad.

And don't even try to say my opinion isn't valid...you guys bash DotD's story quite a lot(well....GamingMaster does anyway!), so I think me simply saying these stories were bad is fine. I don't give me the "they weren't about story" excuse....the story is part of the games coding, ergo, it's perfectly reasonable to judge.

Yes, but I don't see how the stories are bad.

Id say explain how, but it'd be off-topic.

Neither do I. The stories hadn't been done before, and back then, story was unimportant. There wasn't anything really bad - No plotholes, no unexplained areas, etc.

Otherwise we'll be giving Space Invaders a low score too.....

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Space Invaders

I have Space Invader pants on right now! XP

A storyline only ruins a game if it is beyond horrible, and that is how I feel about DoTD's. I.E.: Super Mario Galaxy 2

Quote: Spyroo

Because back in the days of those games, no game relied on story....

In my opinion, you either do a great story, or you just don't bother with one.

Hmmm, no games relied on story back then, huh?

*COUGH* METAL GEAR SOLID *COUGH*

*coughSMG2cough*

Quote: spyro14ever

Quote: Spyroo

Because back in the days of those games, no game relied on story....

In my opinion, you either do a great story, or you just don't bother with one.

Hmmm, no games relied on story back then, huh?

*COUGH* METAL GEAR SOLID *COUGH*

Obviously, I meant most games.

Quote: Spyroo

Quote: spyro14ever

Quote: Spyroo

Because back in the days of those games, no game relied on story....

In my opinion, you either do a great story, or you just don't bother with one.

Hmmm, no games relied on story back then, huh?

*COUGH* METAL GEAR SOLID *COUGH*

Obviously, I meant most games.

Nothing against you, just sayin'

Quote: spyro14ever

Quote: Spyroo

Quote: spyro14ever

Hmmm, no games relied on story back then, huh?

*COUGH* METAL GEAR SOLID *COUGH*

Obviously, I meant most games.

Nothing against you, just sayin'

Lol, fair enough

Sorry to jump into the story thing again, but in my opinon the story was pretty decent. The only reason the gamemakers did those things were because they knew they wanted to make them teenagers but they were stuck in a crystel so they just let them grow inside it.
The end I know eveyone hated, but that was the gamemakers view on a climatic ending with the fury, cynder's love message, and sparx being left behind in the new world. But, it was a good attempt at a story.

But what about all the other plotholes? I'm sorry, but the Chronicler changing colour and design almost completely makes no sense. And the massive Destroyer plothole... Don't get me started, Kay?

Quote: GamingMaster_76

But what about all the other plotholes? I'm sorry, but the Chronicler changing colour and design almost completely makes no sense. And the massive Destroyer plothole... Don't get me started, Kay?

You technically started yourself.

I know. XP

Chronicler seemed to be a spirit that became who he was and now that ignitus is there he can leave and let him record the futures and etc. But, you are right, there are a lot of plotholes, but given that I am used to stories having plotholes I really don't care.
The destroyer? What plothole? He was summoned to destroy the planet bye walking then crawling back into the volcano.

But Spyro and Cynder destroyed its heart and all its support, the dark gems on him. And then it gets up and survives...

You know technically a rock can't have a gender.

If this just didn't have so many plot holes and better mechanics... I would have enjoyed it much more.

^Well he seemed very boyish to me. But your right.
Obviously the gamemakers wanted you to kill IT but they wanted IT to come back to life but had no clue how to do it and they seemed to not have anything CREATIVE in their minds.

I know I said the story was DECENT because it is, just not good, at least it resembles the fashion of a story.

I just wish that it had fixed a few of the major ones or the ones completely against the laws of everything and I would be happy. At least they aren't rushing Spyro's Kingdom.

THAT would be catostrophic, but STD Spyro would sooooo kill the destroyer faster with his charging and poorly digitized fire, and trash talking. And it would actually STAY dead. Unlike DOTD Spyro's efforts who ust walks around all emo.

LOL! Imagine a speedway inside the Destroyer's body!

*would make a cominc of it, but sucks at making comics and has no DA account to post it*

Honestly, the story had so many plotholes that you were better off ignoring it along with the design and focus on what's important; the freakin gameplay.

Story helps move along a game, but it depends on if the developers want a story or not. There are games out there like Heavy Rain that rely on the story to progress the game. And then you have games like Donkey Kong Country Returns that doesn't need a story to be an amazing game. It's not up to us if the story plays a heavy part of the game or not. We only decide if the story sucks or not.

If a game has cutscenes, I never skip them, no matter how bad, and DoTD is no exclusion. Because I actually want to enjoy the cutscenes in a game.

The gameplay, I'm sorry, it just hasn't got nearly enough to make up for it for me.

The thing about dotd is that it is veeery repeatitive. On every level you:
1) beginning cutscene
2) do a quest that envoles either rescuing, fighting, pulling levers, gathering, or protecting.
3) some side cutsceane to reward you for your progress
4) Boss fight/strong enemy battle
5) end cutsceane

THAT is what happens once or even twice in each level.

Well, I didn't feel that way in VoA, but every other level, yes.

Quote: pie1

The thing about dotd is that it is veeery repeatitive. On every level you:
1) beginning cutscene
2) do a quest that envoles either rescuing, fighting, pulling levers, gathering, or protecting.
3) some side cutsceane to reward you for your progress
4) Boss fight/strong enemy battle
5) end cutsceane

THAT is what happens once or even twice in each level.

Not really...different levels are based around different things.

Yes, but they have the same basic thing. Except VoA your right about that GamingMaster. But here's an example:

Dragon City

Step 1) opening cutsceane.

Step 2) SAVING freaking moles from a flaming house which requires gathing of buckets and water.

Step 3) side cutscene with the flames

skips to Step 5) ending cutsceane

REAPETING TO STEP 1 with war cutsceane

Step 2) is reapeated with the protecting of the singular catapult (I will never ever get only having one)

Step 3) side cutscene with shooting siege towers etc

Step 4) That grass monster.

Step 5) ending cutscene to golum.

In Burned Lands, the only cutscene is Iggy's death, and the mission throughout the whole level is to reach the volcano.
In Floating Islands, there are no cutscenes.

The burned lands shows cutscenes of cynder not wanting to go and there are plenty of strong enemy fights as you move throughout the area. I admit there is no ending cutsceane.

The floating islands also has a term of 'boss battle' with the area right before Malafor's lair.

Cutscene 1: Flying into the area with them complamenting it.
Cutscene 2: Scary monsters attacking them.

They aren't cutscenes, just little snippets to let you know of your objective.

Actually, The Burnt Lands kinda did have an end scene.

Spyro and Cynder think about what might be held in Malefor's Lair and look up to the Floating Islands.

Still cutscenes to me if they flatten the screen.

Quote:

Spyro and Cynder think about what might be held in Malefor's Lair and look up to the Floating Islands.

That was near the beginning of the level, not the end...

Quote: sonicbrawler182

Quote:

Spyro and Cynder think about what might be held in Malefor's Lair and look up to the Floating Islands.

That was near the beginning of the level, not the end...

Now that I think about it, that was kore in the middle. It just felt like the start because the enemies were way too hard to kill.

I didn't find them too hard!

...

Now... I have hatred for this game...

In Soviet Russia, game hate you!

Good.

.....ok..

What?

Console review...

If you're looking for a game with good replay value and an interesting storyline, look elsewhere, but give it a shot if you're a casual action gamer.

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Gameplay: 7.5/10
The console version rarely shook much up. It's a bit of a button-masher, and was only difficult in one level. There are more moves than the other Spyro games, but they're essentially all the same and look more fancy, with a blocking attack. I'll admit it, flight was poor, but it was still possible to reach good heights with it if you went up from a ledge. Though the freedom was not there, even in the level which was supposed to be more steadily paced than the others. The elemental attacks of Cynder were very annoying to move around with, but were still an alright change. In the first few times I went though it was fun experimenting with different attacks and flying around, but because of the small variety of enemies or even different bosses, I never got a new thrill out of the console version. Spamming with most of the elements was ridiculously easily possible.

Mechanics/Control: 7.5/10
The controls on the Wii were HORRIBLE because of lifting your Nunchuck to block. On all the other versions, they should be easy to get used to. There's not really much to say about them, anyway. They're just some standard controls, except your breath is now activated by the side triggers. The flight, as stated above, was hardly impressive. The wall climbing was decent but underused, and sliding along the walls was frustrating, as it was hard to move in the right direction and you constantly slipped from it. Multiplayer was poor and WILL be confusing for first-time action players. A younger one may be able to figure it out, however. Everybody else should be fine with it.

Graphics: 7.5/10
The console version had good graphics. My only mumbles about it are that they were lazily implemented and they're given too much credit. Spyro hovers in air, Cynder bites through her wing spike, Sparx is lying five inches above ground, and Ignitus slams into an entire building without ONE SCRATCH! These are overrated. Super Mario Galaxy came out the year before and had better graphics than this. At least it had a style for the entire game instead of chucking levels together randomly. I only truly went 'wow' at **two levels, and after a while even those got boring.

Soundtrack: 7/10
Soundtrack had too many reused themes. They were still nice, but I was expecting new themes. The actually added themes had everything from some really odd parts to some really beautiful bits.

Storyline: 1/10
Incredibly poor. To those who haven't played this yet, you may want to skip this section, as it contains 'major' spoilers. The console version contains a massively bad amount of plotholes, and I can't think of a single level, except the Ruins of Warfang, without any. For example, in The Catacombs- Once surrounded by a collapsing mountain and now by a neat path, Spyro and Cynder grew up while they were supposed to be frozen in time, then, when freed, their enemies make them face a Golem instead of killing them or giving them to Malefor(if you look closely here, you can also see the two dragons actually walking away with the enemies). You find out Sparx was somehow safe within all of this. Then- the worst pothole of the game takes place. CYNDER learns four elements. CYNDER. Only PURPLE dragons are meant to learn four! This can almost be called an INSULT! And you know how long it takes? Literally a few minutes, right after one of the Chronicler's two appearances! This was during a cutscene with one of the now different-looking spirit crystals, and was the only one that broke from a single touch or even had any visions from it. Now I'll go on with rants for the rest of the levels. In Twilight Falls, Hunter(yes, he's here) can leap across rocks faster than Spyro and Cynder fly, on two legs. Now, normally, this would be natural for a cheetah like himself- but on two legs? No. Speaking of body build, Spyro and Cynder shouldn't even be able to stand due to their odd bone placement on their hind legs. Next level- Valley of Avalar. Hunter gets 'chained' to a post without any actual chain. Something similar while the villagers there rebuild their houses; they're repairing them by pushing down, but on empty spots of air. These are more like graphical mishaps, but listen to this: Meadow, a rescued cheetah, says he breaks one of his legs, but after Spyro and Cynder get a raft for bringing him back to the village he manages to pull himself back to the cave entrance, and within a few minutes he's up and standing well again after just the help of a cane. Dragon City- Small building of rubble. Can't be flown over. Really? So dragons can fly around a village but not over rubble? Also- as a side note- there are LAZY 32-bit graphics in the background of a war, which the two dragons again manage to stop despite just coming out only two days before. Then the Golem comes and the army retreats and mysteriously disappears forever. Also, all the Guardians, apart from Ignitus, get a grand combined total of four lines(one for Cyril and Volteer each and two for Terraddor). Nothing I see in Ruins of Warfang. Then in The Dam there are one or two plotholes including the mysterious disappearance of some reinforcements. The Destroyer contains several plotholes, one of which is major- a massive beast's heart is destroyed, yet it still lives and is better than it was before it was even intercepted. The Burnt Lands also has an extreme major one- Ignitus DIES by flying THROUGH the Ring of Fire instead of simply saving himself and going over, which could have also let to a new level opportunity. Shame, really. And in the Floating Islands Spyro and Cynder fly above it to get to where the last boss resides. And lastly... Malefor's Lair. Malefor is a WEAK boss, even compared to the other two. And he just confuses you with some unconfirmed sayings and a little Dark Cynder scene. The last basic plothole. Absolutely horrid.

Polish: 7/10
As I just ranted, the storyline had absolutely none of this. It was rushed. Glitches are well fixed. There are a few notable ones, but I was fine with most of them. Environments were cleaned up decently well.

Please excuse the double post...
___
Difficulty/Extras: 6.5/10
A decent amount. The unlockables have one of the highest amount of a Spyro game, but many are easy to find, and I only had trouble finding the ones that were badly placed. That was quite a few of them, so get ready for mild frustration. Difficulty is basically non-existent. Or for somebody without knowledge of how to play video games, way too hard. I played this with my mum and sister, and they both thought it was too confusing, but I thought it was way too easy. No trouble at all with any of the puzzles, because they are pretty linear. The fighting is completely gone if you upgrade Spyro's Ice element and repeatedly spam enemies with a normal Ice Storm. This is basically the same with all of the other powers, too. Once you upgrade about 60% of them, you'll just need to hold down a button.

Voice acting: 8.5/10
I thought it was good, I don't see what so many people had against it, but many scenes had poor actual lines. This one is really a question of personal taste, probably best defined as a mixed set.

Lipsync/Design: 5.5/10
Poor. Character mouths have odd expressions and have arkward jaw movement, and almost all of the design style changed.

Execution: 4/10
One of the worst parts of the game. SPOILER ALERT! After the last boss- who was incredibly easy- Cynder says 'I love you'. Ignitus' death, as mentioned before, was also badly put in. The execution was beyond bad.

Overall: 6.2
The Legend of Spyro: Dawn of The Dragon could have done so much more. Thanks to Sierra and Activision, fans like me waiting for something after the great cliffhanger The Eternal Night was were left with a badly executed game completely different to its predecessors, that had gimmicks strapped onto it to try and cover up all the problems within. Just go and look elsewhere for an interesting storyline with something like Professor Layton or try the Gameboy Advance version of this game's prequel for a really good fighting game. This has almost no replay value and is tedious after you finish it. And it doesn't take a genius to notice the errors; it just takes someone who is not a mindless fool or doesn't try to follow suit with hiding them. IT IS NOT FILLED WITH UNEXPLAINED SECTIONS. IT IS FILLED WITH PLOTHOLES. The gameplay doesn't even come close to making up for these with its horrible balance that confuses younger players and is too easy for even the average fan. Just skip out on it. This may not be the worst game ever, but many other ones are much better and even cheaper.
___

End rant.
DS review...
If you can't get enough of Spyro and want another game for your on-the-go collection, this is for you from Tantalus.
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Gameplay: 8.5/10
The DS did a better-than-average job with this and I got more out of it than its larger cousin on the TV, with both enemies and experience. The different attacks on it were of a smaller amount, but were more challenging to pull off. There isn't any flight in the platforming levels, but they're side-scrollers, and free flight wouldn't go well with them at all! The flight levels, by the way, were particularly good and gave me the best experience of the game, but I was disappointed that they didn't allow you to switch elements and personalize your style. It would have been nice to see something like the Wind or Ice attacks, or to see a truly free flight within them that allowed you to explore and find collectables.

Mechanics/Control: 9/10
This version did make me mix up melees and breaths from time to time. The A, B, X and Y buttons once again activate attacks and allow you to jump, with the barrel roll from the previous game removed, replaced by an elemental swipe which is basically a normal hit with extra power. There's also a mechanic which returns from A New Beginning- you can see the weaknesses of enemies. Not just that, but what they're immune against. In fact, you can simply hit them with an advantageous elemental melee to get extra damage and some gems to upgrade your powers. There's even an enemy immune to Spyro and Cynder's magical attacks, who you need to hit with normal powers. That was quite clever and there was good challenge from the handful of them in the game. And one of my favorite points: FLIGHT LEVELS. Absolutely gorgeous. Beautiful graphics, good-pace gameplay, and obstacles you actually need to avoid hitting.

Graphics: 8/10
The DS version had nice graphics, but they were a bit blocky and weren't implemented well. The cutscene art had nice parts in it but was also a bit odd with the character looks at the same time.

Soundtrack: 8/10
Soundtrack had some nice remixes but none of them were really memorable standouts, so there's little to talk about here.

Storyline: 7.5/10
You'll only understand this if you've read one of my console version reviews: the DS version misses out on most plotholes and ends up with a brilliantly better tale. It's almost like comparing the Mario movie to the games. However, one new one appears. The monster that would have caused the world to end- the Destroyer- is killed, yet the world still begins to crumble. Also, it was rather abrupt at times and missed out on a few of the levels, but that's forgivable because the storyline was really the biggest problem, and fixed. However, it's a bit upsetting it didn't go quite as deep. The Ruins of Warfang could have been great in DS version format.

Polish: 8/10
Glitches are well fixed. There are a few notable ones, but I was fine with most of them. Level designs were fixed really well, in my opinion.

Difficulty/Extras: 7/10
Very few collectables, there are just the health and mana upgrades to find, but there is decent challenge if you're planning on upgrading the elements fully. They were in a similar situation to the storyline. On the console version, upgrading just one particular element caused it to be far too easy, but on this version, they were much more balanced. While there are no true secondary attacks, I still felt more variety with them, even if only because Cynder's were sorted differently. But the puzzles were easy. There were only elemental gates, and it's not hard to test each element on them or remember what works on what. However, the level design was actually decently wide, and I did get trapped within a few mazes at a couple of points. The enemies(save for those Trolls) had larger health bars as well.

Voice acting: 8.5/10
I thought it was good, I don't see what so many people had against it, but many scenes had poor actual lines. This one is really a question of personal taste, probably best defined as a mixed set.

Lipsync/Design: 7/10
The DS version has no cutscene animation, just, again, quite nice art pieces, but thankfully the true voice acting was put in with this.

Exectution: 7.5/10
Better on DS than a big HD(or not) screen, thanks once again to points with problems in the storyline that were missing. The execution was still quite bland, but not nearly as bad as the console version. Only one part was real stick-out bad, and it was the ending, but another notable point is in the Dragon City. Some of the earlier character lines feel somewhat randomly placed.

Overall: 7.9
This version the game is a good, underrated game with flying sections on the side that make it feel complete in balance. While they're certainly the highlight of the game and their environments blend with eachother well, the regular side-scrolling stages are just as fun, involving thought, speed and elemental strategy for fighting and rewarding exploration with upgrades and the satisfying explosion from upgrading an attack. This genre of gaming is so uncommon on handhelds nowadays, so if you've ever wanted one and have a DS then this is a must-have.

Quote:

IT IS NOT FILLED WITH UNEXPLAINED SECTIONS. IT IS FILLED WITH PLOTHOLES.

A plothole is something that has no possible explanation e.g Why didn't they fly over the building in Warfang?

Unexplained means it wasn't touched on in the game, but can easily have sense made out of it e.g The Destroyer not dying after his heart is destroyed - we seen his eyes glow with dark magic in the cutscene after the level, so it's obvious Malefor done something...or, just consider the fact this isn't a human with a heart that pumps blood, but a rock monster with a floating purple heart....the heart was not connected to any arteries, veins or capillaries, as this is a ROCK MONSTER i.e a fictional creature, therefore, you cannot possibly say what would indefinitly kill it...

Also, Spyro and Cynder DIDN'T grow inside the crystal...it was a change in art style. They are about the same height compared to Ignitus as they were in the other games, but everything seems to be on a bigger scale in EL's style, including the other dragons.

I would clear up more, and possibly point out more plotholes, but I'm sick and have not played the game in a while. But a lot of the "plotholes" in DotD are just things that were not explained properly(some of them should of been though) and didn't make much of a difference to the plot in the long run anyway, and looking at them in great detail is just plain nitpicky. This is a video game, not a book(and before you call me a hypocrite, I'm not saying you shouldn't disregard a games story when reviewing it...I'm saying that it is tertiary to the experience, and therefore, should be taken with a pinch of salt. I can understand rabid Krome fans getting annoyed at this game's story, but seriously....it's not THAT bad, and I have seen a hell of a lot worse...)

If you want REAL plotholes, get Sonic 06...

I do agree with you on the voice-acting part. One commonly used point was that Christina Ricci had "no emotion", especially in the Ignitus death scene. But after playing the DS version and hearing the voice clips without background music and sound effects, I now firmly believe she did a great job voicing Cynder.

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The gameplay doesn't even come close to making up for these with its horrible balance that confuses younger players and is too easy for even the average fan.

Please start reading all of my lines.
I knew you would just reply with something like that. I enjoyed TLoS mainly because of its storyline, which was a fresh change. But with DoTD...

I am not going to extend off of my rant because it is going to go nowhere and nobody will ever just suck it up.

I read all of your llines...

I don't see how the balance was bad. My sister can play the game fine, and only needed help on Golem and Elite Enemies. Also, my cousins can play fine too. And I am going through the game with just melee attacks and no upgrades, and haven't died yet, so....

The first time I played, I thought it was pretty challenging, and while it doesn't always clearly tell you what to do next, the Classic Spyros were the same, and I like finding out what to do for myself, so I didn't mind....if anything, it gave me nostalgia!

I never seen TLoS as being solely about story at all(though, it's still an excellent storyline), especially with ANB...and possibly TEN.

Like I said in another topic (and where everyone agreed with me) - Unexplained is an extremely irritating excuse. It's the same as a plothole, let it go and stop making excuses.

I don't do it for any game I like, and I'm sick of hearing DotD have excuses made now.

Developers often leave things unexplained on purpose either to let players speculate, or, because they have the sense to know that this is a videogame and that every little detail DOESN'T need to be explained....

If DotD is full of "plotholes", then so are the Classic Spyros, as they neglected to explain a LOT in them....in fact, nearly every game I play has unexplained stuff, so I guess they all have terrible stories....
...but in either series, I don't really care, seeing as...you know...this is a game were talking about, and not a book...

And don't tell me what I should and shouldn't think....there is a difference between leaving things unexplained and things that can't have any sense made out of them at all...

"OMG, THEY DIDN'T EXPLAIN WHY EMBER LIKES SPYRO!!!111!!"....going by the logic of "unexplained=plothole", then this is a huge plothole...and I can think of many instances in the Classic games that lacked explanation too, but I don't see them as plotholes...just things that were unexplained. It's easy to make sense out of the...same goes for a lot of "plotholes" in LoS...and no, I don't see the fact that "why Ember likes Spyro" wasn't explained as a plothole...

I didn't tell you what you should think. I told you what I and many others think.

The thing is, you love DotD - So you can't see anything past the good parts when it comes to plotholes. I'm personally sick of seeing people try and make DotD's storyline sound just fine - It wasn't. There WERE plotholes.

And like I said, if classic Spyro has plotholes.... Eh, fair enough. I won't keep telling people that there weren't any if that's what they believe.

I'm afraid you're barking up the wrong tree when you keep responding to people who see the plotholes though - Just because you can't, doesn't mean that others can't either.

Saying it's unexplained isn't an excuse. Yes, there are plenty of plotholes in TLoS, but some things are unexplained. Like brawler said, just because the game didn't cover something, doesn't make it a plothole. Yes there are plotholes, but that doesn't mean that every single thing not just explained for you is a plothole..