darkSpyro

Quote: defpally

If/when Skylanders dies, it will be from their own sword, not from a another game. These games all have different audiences. There needs to be a big step up in innovation, not just another story with more toys. If they just release another straight game with more toys it is their own fault they will be compared with other franchises unfavorably.

I had bee navoiding this thread and was about to post - and realized its the exact opposite of your post.

When Skylanders dies, it will be for the SAME reason that Guitar Heroes died.

too many tinykitty clones/copies. The market place is getting FLOODED with Toys to Life now, there was enough space for Landers & DI, then Amiibo's came in, adding ABSOLUTELY NO VALUE to the games (speaking as someone wiht like 7 of them), and somehow is eating up space. I go to Walmart and "How To Train Your Dragon" and "Transformers" have low budget, jack into the TV toys to life games. Now Lego, who is about to cash in HARD off the success of their movie with 3 new movies is going to flood the market with their figures, and who else knows what's coming.

Don't be shocked to see a NBA2k16 where those with the right baseball cards can scan them to get create a player points, or access to 'legendary' characters like "Always in MSG Jordan" or "In Toronto Kobe".

It's not a matter of people 'wising up' to the pay model, I think money is just going to be spread WAY too thin, and people are just going to lose interest. Collectors won't be able to keep up. Parent's will just say no. Kids will simply 'fracture' their interest so much that there won't be a 'strong' attraction to any of them...

And the market will - not quickly, but surely, crumble - from over exposure.

I honestly got sick to hear of Lego doing a TtL game. It doesn't even sound interesting...it sounds like "Lego the Movie, w/ expensive physical DLC". I don't care how good they can be, I don't WANT anymore TtL games. Just let what's out there 'breathe'.
- Unreall

Well, I'd agree with you if they were fighting for the same customer. What defpally and others (including myself) believe is that their target audience is different and therefore shouldn't impact the TTL market in general. I do think there will be some give and take here, for example a skylander fan that also absolutely loves Disney or Legos. That customer may have to make a choice as to which franchise to spend money in.

There's an argument on the table that the crossover isn't dramatic or great. I do agree in general that too much TTL product will crowd the market and cause an implosion, but I don't think we're there yet. The other problem with Guitar Hero look alike is that they were basically the same game---not exactly so here. The experience between these games have similar qualities but provide a different experience. Playing music games were all very very similar.

There's a really good point there with Skylanders and GH being apples and oranges. Skylanders will only get repetitive if they make it so - plenty of space for genre shifts and spinoffs. GH could've changed around a bit but they really never seemed to try to deviate except maybe with a story mode or two, and if they wanted to stay selling the controllers, they could only change the gameplay to a point.
Just hope Acti learned their lesson, attempting to bring it back and all.You don't overspecialize an entire franchise. Hope VV also did, since they made a good chunk of the games.

One thing the Amiibo offers to nintendo fans is an affordable figurine of their favorite character . Your usual geek boutique offers those at about 4 - 6 times that of an amiibo

Bitfrost: Agreed. Skylanders will get dull if they allow it to get that way. Again, their sword to fall on.

Quote: Dark fhoenix

One thing the Amiibo offers to nintendo fans is an affordable figurine of their favorite character . Your usual geek boutique offers those at about 4 - 6 times that of an amiibo

They are also usually specialized limited editions, and not mass produced. Very similar in terms of how people are treating Amiibo though. A nice shelf figure of your favorite characters.

Well mine is one household where this is going to have an impact. This also might be a glimpse a similar household situations. So here's what I know. I know I will get Sky 5 (if it's more of the same it will be my last though). I know I will get D.I. 3.0 (Star Wars man, come on). I know we will get Lego Dimensions (it's Skylander Legos, easy yes). Now one thing I know is that one of them will usually be on sale most of the time. It's like Pepsi, 7up/Dr. Pepper/A & W, and Coke, in that one of them is usually on sale when the others aren't. I have no illusions that we (my household) will need to pace ourselves with what we get. If the release model from last year holds, D.I. in September, Lego in September (ouch) and Sky 5 in October. That's 3 starters in a little over a month. I'm going to start banking away now lol. Amiibo's aren't and issue for us since I personally believe they exist to sell the struggling Wii U. I will never own a Wii U because I don't see the point in paying $300 for last gen tech. So while they will compete for our $$$ I don't know how much any one franchise will suffer. I plan on getting most everything released for all three, just spread out over time. I'll watch sales and take advantage where I can. I just hope TRU doesn't get too many exclusives since they are the most expensive retailer out there (in US anyway). Looking at this again I'm not so much afraid as I am happy that they will all need to compete for our $$$...I just hope they compete in the innovate category as well. The fact that Lego is claiming our initial starter will last us quite a while is a good start.

No. I strongly disagree with the sentiments of 'overlap'. Gameplay does not overlap, but the dollars for said genre is still the exact same pool of money for your typical household. For Xmas my brother in law got my son 4 DI figures, not 4 DI figures and 4 Skylander figures. These games all directly compete for money under the genre of video games and video game accessories. The same way when Avengers 2 comes out there is like a 2 week block of NO other movie really coming out, why? Because they would be fighting with Avengers for money, and they know they'll lose that one haha.

Kevin Hart will be performing in Raleigh April 30th, I would LOVE to go, but I've already bought 'pricey' tickets along with friends - to see Avengers 2. Two separate things, but they are both competing for my dollars and attention.

These are even worse as they occupy the SAME retail space. Two years ago? Skylanders had a wall and a half at my local TRU. One year ago, they shrunk to a wall and relocated the rest of the figures, to make room for DI. This year they cleared out some tech inventory to give DI its own 'isle', so Skylanders cna keep its 'wall', and then gave Amiibo a wall. Next up, we'll have 5 generations of skylanders at TRU, 3 generations of DI, 2 Generations of Amiibos, and now they will have to throw Legos onto a wall ALSO. And TRU is actually equipped to carry all this. Most retailers look like they've given up on having a real 'selection', its simply too much.

So quit lying to yourselves about the competitive aspect of it all. Sure both companies are making money hand over fist right now, but there is a limit, I mean heck I saw the Lego thing and said "nope we don't need another". I'm not even giving the game a CHANCE because I don't have the room, the money, heck even the time, to care about ANOTHER TtL game, and while somethigns about my life are specific, in general I spend more than the average person on TtL and I'm already at my limit. If we get Lego, we are selling DI. It IS a competition.
- Unreall

O.k. but you kind of missed my point...entirely. My point was that SOME families will split their interests and eventually have their toes in many if not all the pools. The industry is counting on it. No ones saying or expects that people will choose one brand and forego the others. How many Cereal brands do we have in the US? Or car companies, video game systems, paid cable channels, Clothing Brands, Electronic Brands, etc. Choice is not a bad thing and forces competition in an open market. Monopolies are much worse for the consumer. If you choose not to participate because you're overwhelmed that's your choice but it will not be indicative of the majority. I'd say for the last year or so I have yet to talk to a parent, hobbyist or collector at TRU that only plays with one Toys to Life system. They are already crossing over and I fear that if Skylanders is the same old song and dance every year people will want a new dance partner and they might not return to their old one.

Unrealistic: I agree, there is finite customers and finite dollars in this market. I do contend there will be contention with some customers...I'm just saying that the crossover with customers will not be an appreciable impact. I do think however that Activision is "on notice"...one slip up on execution (bad game design decisions, giving us "more of the same") will contribute to their faster decline in the market.

I'll personally be watching the competition, because what we think means nothing until the sales are counted. I do think the article saying "we're not worried" could be pestering, because they have to be on their A game here on out.

Tigorus: that's my concern over the skylanders franchise in general. People may choose between "the same old song and dance" to "the new kid on the block"...at least for those that have an interest in the other brands. Those that do not have an interest in those brands and don't feel the skygames provide enough to justify the continued toy "investment" may just may "fall off".

I think it would be better if we could considerate the grays instead of the black and the whites.

Of course they are competitors but not to the point one franchise will "steal" enough customers to kill the other at least as of now.

If I want Skylanders I don't think Infinity could offer me something to change my mind and vice versa.
They still appeal to really different sub-targets.

And saying that there shouldn't be more TtL games just because you already own one is plain unlogical in my opinion.
Non one expects a normal customer to buy Skylanders, Infinity and Amiibo related game and now also Dimensions, not to mention all the related figures.
They would obviously cost too much.

It's all about choice.
Following that mentality there shouldn't be more platformers after Mario.
The TtL industry is still really young and will have lot to offer in the years to come if the people will get over the "robbery" idea and simply buy a game they could love and enjoy playing with.

Let's do some math:

Approximately 18million starter packs sold in the franchise.
Approximately 240million skylanders sold.

It seems the average skyfan purchases 13.3 figures. That would support the "common" skylanders customer.

I'm the common customer then, my collection is at 20 guys after 5 years. Of course, I bought the books, buying the comics digitally, but I really can't spend more than what I already did on them. Veeeery slowly building my collection of favorites,heck took 3 years to get a Pop Fizz(arrived last week) since the variant was going for cheap on Ebay while the only one I found in stores has been sitting without a hand for several months on the shelf.

But even if I COULD buy Dimensions, I wouldn't really be getting all of one or the other, I'd just focus on who I truly REALLY want and give up on some that might take too long to get cheap. If there's anyone that's going to have to split attention,it's Infinity, and it's only if the Marvel vs. DC or Star Wars vs. LOTR wars really cause as much rivalry as the fandoms have in the internet.

(don't even get me started on Amiibos they don't even exist in Brazil and my wallet's going to stop existing too if I get anywhere close to a Meta Knight figure,made myself a point to not get any but just because I'm broke)

Amiibo is the one that I least care about. I only bought the figures for characters that I really like (final total will be 7). I will be getting Skylanders 5, DI Star Wars (it will be this, correct?), and Lego Dimensions. I just won't buy everything for each game. And, this go round I will be more about the sales. Lego may be the pretty costly since it isn't generally known for sales. Of course, if the game languishes on the shelf, then sales may be forthcoming.

Quote: Drek95

I think it would be better if we could considerate the grays instead of the black and the whites.

Of course they are competitors but not to the point one franchise will "steal" enough customers to kill the other at least as of now.

If I want Skylanders I don't think Infinity could offer me something to change my mind and vice versa.
They still appeal to really different sub-targets.

And saying that there shouldn't be more TtL games just because you already own one is plain unlogical in my opinion.
Non one expects a normal customer to buy Skylanders, Infinity and Amiibo related game and now also Dimensions, not to mention all the related figures.
They would obviously cost too much.

It's all about choice.
Following that mentality there shouldn't be more platformers after Mario.
The TtL industry is still really young and will have lot to offer in the years to come if the people will get over the "robbery" idea and simply buy a game they could love and enjoy playing with.

But I actually some what still disagree.

No, Lego isn't going to 'steal' the average person from Skylanders.

It wil lget people to not BUY Skylanders (ultimately).

That's my contention, we are headed to a financial burn-out. I don't consider my collection normal by ANY means, I don't pretend to be normal, but I talk to normal, A LOT. Heck, I'm practically a salesmen for this stuff in person.

It really is no different than Guitar Heroes. If that was the ONLY guitar game series to come out, I don't think it's popularity would have 'crashed'. You can add in Rock Band as your "Disney Infinity" if you will - the market could sustain two. Then the off-shoots came. That's when things went down hill. Everyone had a rhythm game. It's just like my DDR (just got back into it). One brand won't cannibalize the other, they will become crabs in a basket and all get cooked. Market saturation is a REAL thing, why do you think there are only really 'two' brands of toy train makers? Sure there are other brands, but you don't find them at TRU, because the market can't bare it. Also, those other brands have designed themselves to 'work' with the other two brands.

I just see this as an arrow of 'doom'. the market can fully support Landers and DI, that's not a problem. Honestly? Amiibos will have very little impact, the sales that are hot, are of a more 'collectors' vein than players vein, so its full of resellers, and not IMO sustainable (there is a reason it isn't doing so hot in Nintendo's own Japan) - so I don't see it as a full blown threat to the market place, it also isn't associated with a game like the other two, so you don't have the "Skylander Sunday", where parents plopp down stupid cash ()'. The Lego's aren't "Doom" themselves. I think they are pricing themselves out of competition at $100, but its a negative trend, more people will think they can get into the arena, and that will flood the market place, make things confusing, and shrink wallets.
- Unreall

There's a huge difference. You're talking about a rhythm game that released dozens over dozens of games over the years with no change other than X new(minor) gimmick or new songs. New figures in Skylanders change the gameplay,even if the gameplay as a whole doesn't change,and if TFB and VV so wish they can make an entirely new genre for the next games and still keep the same support because the figures just register progress and upgrades,not HOW they'll play. If you're looking for reasons for the series to fail you'll only find them and not reasons why it won't.

The reason Amiibos crash websites is because of the thick headed Nintendo. They create such a limit on the figures that people scramble to get them before they go away. Luckily since SSA that hasn't really been a huge problem.

But what ever they will make, I will hope the must buy additional stuff aspect to reach 100 % is lesser as in TT. I'm not sure if I will give LD a chance. Mostly I get the Lego games later for a cheaper price. And why it must be 100 bucks, just because it's a half Lego building kit with 300 pieces? Do they had looked up at the Starter Sets from Skylanders and DI 2.0, where we pay 70 bucks and almost the half is for the portal and the figures.

The equation is pretty simple, if Vic. Vision doesn't follow the money grabber Trap Team, forget the weak mechanic of light/dark. If they found a way to bring to life old figs, giving a solid reason for fans to not give up the franchise it will works.

If it's a lazy gimmick, openly made to buy tasteless fig, any fan buying it deserves to be stolen.
And come on, we're in 2015, online features are obligatory.

The existance of other franchises like "Marty, the dolorean!!", or "mickey star wars" won't forgive any mistake.

another thing you people here maybe have not given a thought to. is that the shops may not be taking in as much of one game or just quit after a while. when the sales is not going so well for one of the come to life games. this means if you collect one of these games you could find it very hard to get what you want for it. we have already seen sign of this with the skylanders tt this year(adventure packs), and it could get worse when the lego game come out. i have still not found all of the wave 4 for tt, last year i would have been done with wave 4 by now. its a bit worrying for a game where you need to unlock ingame stuff with figures etc.

I don't think I understood a good chunk of the post, but TTs being tasteless or not is a matter of opinion. I might not like them all but they still had great quality, even if their GIMMICK wasn't good. It's like saying Ghost Roaster doesn't deserve a repose because Grim Creeper is the better ghost bully.
Rewarding people for having old figs is a way of keeping fans,but to bring in new ones you HAVE to make new ones. It doesn't mean 50 new figs,but if you make a new archetype or species, you're going to get the attention of someone from outside who didn't care about the franchise until then. Dark and Light actually open more possibilities because shadow or laser-based skylander designs that would've gotten shoved out of they way for more fitting Undead and Magic/Tech can have their chance, as long as it's not the same gameplay and abilities over and over.

i have just given up on the traps after i got one of each, its just to much to collect. when you have the figures, the adventure packs and then all the traps on top of that.. something just had to go. so i hope sky5 only have figures and adventure packs and nothing more.

Keep hoping,if people are running from TRU to TRU after every mold it's telling them that cheap magic items en masse are a good idea as opposed to Battle Packs and whatnot. Though that'd be judging sales by the collectors here - chances are kids are just getting their favorite molds because they won't really bother to get the ones they don't like and their parents will be happy for that.

This is one of the main reasons Lego Dimensions is a threat:

"LEGO Dimensions not only offers a bridge between digital and physical LEGO play, but also introduces a digital system of play with great long-term value for LEGO gaming. One LEGO Toy Pad, LEGO Gateway and the videogame found in the initial Starter Pack will offer endless opportunities to customize a player’s experience for years to come. Future expansion pack purchases will continue to work with the Starter Pack, even in the fall of next year. No compatibility chart necessary."

Source:
http://www.gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=250755

So the $100 starter will last longer than your average starter and there aren't any planned cyclical releases for the software. The content is coming from the pieces and playsets....OMFG who'd a thunk!!! One of the biggest complaints I hear is having to buy a new edition/version every year like clockwork. It's getting old (correction, is old). In comes Lego, now with the best priced Starter EVER!!!!, and giving players a sigh of relief. This policy will be the selling/breaking point for a lot (not all). This move should shame D.I. and Skylanders in that, if a newcomer can do it why can't they?

They say that now,the same way other companies said that a game would last years to come(then the servers were shut down because of poor handling). You guys are betting on things they're saying,not that they're doing. Watch them need a new stargate -cough- portal for future games as well,probably to support the player-built figures instead of standard ones.

Quote:

"LEGO Dimensions not only offers a bridge between digital and physical LEGO play, but also introduces a digital system of play with great long-term value for LEGO gaming. One LEGO Toy Pad, LEGO Gateway and the videogame found in the initial Starter Pack will offer endless opportunities to customize a player’s experience for years to come. Future expansion pack purchases will continue to work with the Starter Pack, even in the fall of next year. No compatibility chart necessary."

this for sure can be a threat to the skylanders franchise.

Quote: Bifrost

They say that now,the same way other companies said that a game would last years to come(then the servers were shut down because of poor handling). You guys are betting on things they're saying,not that they're doing. Watch them need a new stargate -cough- portal for future games as well,probably to support the player-built figures instead of standard ones.

I usually give the benefit of the doubt to people/companies until they prove me wrong. I have no reason to doubt them. I'm sure they've done market research and concluded that people are sick of the cycle. Also Lego is in the best position in the Toys to Life market. Their product is software with a physical product they've been making and will continue to make if Dimensions doesn't pan out. The general pulse is that people want to play this game.

Quote: FaboulousFab

The equation is pretty simple, if Vic. Vision doesn't follow the money grabber Trap Team, forget the weak mechanic of light/dark. If they found a way to bring to life old figs, giving a solid reason for fans to not give up the franchise it will works.

If it's a lazy gimmick, openly made to buy tasteless fig, any fan buying it deserves to be stolen.
And come on, we're in 2015, online features are obligatory.

The existance of other franchises like "Marty, the dolorean!!", or "mickey star wars" won't forgive any mistake.

Those are mostly personal opinion, which I respect but don't share.
Here's are mine.

I don't see how Trap Team would be more "money gabber" than every other previous Skylanders game.

*sarcasm mode on*
"Uuuuuh, it requires me to buy thousands of traps even if I could simply settle with one per Element and even tells me that I need at least one Trap Master per Element which is totally different from how SWAP Force required at least a character per movement type, not to mention the 4 Adventure Packs who gives me replayability, but who cares?! Robbers!"
*sarcasm mode off*

I don't like the gimmick of the Trap Masters, it could have been developed better but I love the majority of the characters.
I love the trap gimmick and looking forward to see it supported and maybe improved in Skylanders 5.
And I am really interested to see how V.V. will deal with the Light and Dark Elements; I would be completely fine even if they won't add new characters but they will have to acknowledge them in some way.

Online mandatory?
Please don't even get me started with it, I'll just assume you purposely exaggerated there.

Other franchises should watch their backs too if we want to boil it down to these terms.
Amiibos are already "failing" as TtL figures and frankly Disney Infinity 2.0 doesn't seem to have innovated that much from his 1.0 version.

I think somewhere in between Unreal and others is reality. There's not a zero impact for new entrants, and we know they are chasing the same dollars. The games are different enough that I think it will help minimize the impact. Also, competition is good in that it makes sure we get the best game / value possible. that's a positive. Too many entries can create consumer burnout. That's a negative.

The other real problem is real estate in stores. When only skylanders, I think we got decent coverage in stores. Wal Mart and Target have less and less shelf space for skylanders if they have to cover more entries...and will become problematic for ALL entries if they don't expand the space. Wal Mart is already showing a willingness to carry less skystock.

Also on Lego: I seem to recall Disney Infinity claiming their starter pack was "future proof"...but if I recall if you wanted to play marvel you had to buy another starter set. I'd personally would like a LARGE game that can last me 6 months than a $30 playset that lasts 3 hours until I wait for another one. So, I think I'm in a mode where their statements have to be proven by fact. Words are just words.

Drek: Despite what you think, more people are onboard the online train. Definitely more than last year. And people are seeing what we are potentially missing from the experience as a result of its omission. I think it's time for "something" online to happen.

TakeYourLemons, I'm glad someone else recalls DI saying their starter packs were future proof and would 'last for years'.

Publishers can basically say anything they feel like until the product releases, it seems. Look at all the changes TT made in it's development.

Microsoft's way of dismantling competition was spreading FUD (fear uncertainty and doubt) and I see that here. Prove it or shut it I say.

I've never quite seen such a dramatic change in how TfB changed some core gameplay mechanics literally weeks before shipping the product. It's the darnedest thing I've ever seen. Looks agile as heck, but the frontside marketing was a disaster. I do NOT want that to happen this time. Don't say squat until July if you need to, just make sure you are 1. sure and 2. decisive in your marketing communication.

And know the first two questions that will be asked is: 1. trap support and 2. online support.

Quote:

Also on Lego: I seem to recall Disney Infinity claiming their starter pack was "future proof"...but if I recall if you wanted to play marvel you had to buy another starter set.

The DI claim is true for 2.0. You only had to buy a starter pack to get the game. You didn't need a new portal to play with the Marvel characters, or other 2.0 characters. The only difference is the new portal has a larger "Disney Infinity" insignia on it. With the release of the Toy Box Starter Pack, all the contents of both, except the game and portal, could be bought separately.

It remains to be seen if the same will hold true for future games. And, I doubt anyone will sell the respective game without including a base with it. Skylanders had the Portal Owner's Pack for Giants, but couldn't do that for Swap Force or Trap Team. Plus, many consumers found it more economical to buy the Starter Pack vs the Portal Owner's Pack.

I'm DI ignorant, so you're saying you could buy the game without the portal in 2.0? I ask because everywhere I look it looks like the $75 version with the portal. If you get 2.0 first, you cant get 1.0 without the portal?

I don't care if I get more portals, but if I can save $15 or more on the starter by not including it, great...but for me it's not a barrier to entry. I too think the portal is part of the experience...

No. A portal is included with all DI Starter packs. I'm saying that a NEW portal wasn't required, even though it came in the starter pack, to play with the new 2.0 characters. The 1.0 portal worked with the new 2.0 characters. DI maintained its future compatibility with 2.0, even though the consumer would still have a 1.0 and 2.0 portal.

Skylanders was future compatible for 2.0 (Giants), but a new portal was required for 3.0 (Swap Force) and again for 4.0 (Trap Team). With Giants, the consumer had the option to buy a regular Starter pack or a Portal Owner's pack (no Portal and only Tree Rex Giant).

Saying it didn't need a new portal but not providing one didn't really help the consumer out though. Not sure about others, but the portal owner's pack was priced poorly. In essence, a failed marketing attempt.

Quote: TakeYourLemons

Saying it didn't need a new portal but not providing one didn't really help the consumer out though. Not sure about others, but the portal owner's pack was priced poorly. In essence, a failed marketing attempt.

Absolutely. When I worked the launch of Skylanders Giants, I actively encouraged people to pay the difference (I think it was $10. $15? Is that right?) just to get the extra two Skylanders (Jet-Vac and Cynder) and a spare Portal of Power. If the Owner's Pack had been, say, $40 I think we'd have seen more of a demand for the Owner's Pack. I know our store unloaded most of our Owner's Packs during the great TRU clearance purge last year when things got 90% off.

Quote: TakeYourLemons

Drek: Despite what you think, more people are onboard the online train. Definitely more than last year. And people are seeing what we are potentially missing from the experience as a result of its omission. I think it's time for "something" online to happen.

I'm aboard it too, never said I wansn't.
However one thing is saying it would be an appreciated feature another is saying it is mandatory these days.

That was clearly an exaggeration.

Online is just something that needs to happen. Both for patching bugs and longevity of value. The ability to play with friends remotely is huge. Activision/Blizz know a little something about secure networking and I'm sure they could figure something out. Given that other kid friendly franchises have figured it out I'm not buying the "it's not safe for kids" argument anymore. I'm sure a lot of us hear in the Dark Spyro community would love the opportunity to play co-op or pvp. It would make the franchise worth bragging about again lol.

Quote: Tigorus

This is one of the main reasons Lego Dimensions is a threat ...

It sounds good, but currently we know all and the half. Somewhere I read something about up to 7 figures at the same time on the portal. What would be no unique for a Lego game, where we had in every game one or more companions, but no one of the two other franchises has something like that. I'd love to see this anytime in a Skylanders-game, three core-landers on the portal, I play one, while the CPU controll the two others. But back to LD. In the next 5 1/2 month I want to see more from the game and I hope for a lot more informations.

The problems with three or soon for figure franchises at the same time is the hunt for them. I have no idea what is happening in this year with Activision. In the last year it was no problem to get six more Swap Force characters and the two adventure packs, but to get 7 more Trap Masters, the two adventure packs and the two elemental packs in this year is awful. At least here in Germany. No idea how it is in other countries. All is full with figures, but no one of that I want. I needed several months to get Wallop, Krypt King and Wildfire. Last I was lucky enough to get a Kaos trap and the Light elemental pack. But I've no idea how many weeks or months I will need to get Blastermind or the Dark elemental pack.

Wherefore we need a game, where the hunt for the figures is game enough ?

Quote: Tigorus

Online is just something that needs to happen. Both for patching bugs and longevity of value. The ability to play with friends remotely is huge. Activision/Blizz know a little something about secure networking and I'm sure they could figure something out. Given that other kid friendly franchises have figured it out I'm not buying the "it's not safe for kids" argument anymore. I'm sure a lot of us hear in the Dark Spyro community would love the opportunity to play co-op or pvp. It would make the franchise worth bragging about again lol.

Absolutely, absolutely and absolutely.

And honestly I could see it happening with V.V. leading the development.
They seem to be the most innovative between the two companies.

Quote: Jeriba

Quote: Tigorus

This is one of the main reasons Lego Dimensions is a threat ...

It sounds good, but currently we know all and the half. Somewhere I read something about up to 7 figures at the same time on the portal. What would be no unique for a Lego game, where we had in every game one or more companions, but no one of the two other franchises has something like that. I'd love to see this anytime in a Skylanders-game, three core-landers on the portal, I play one, while the CPU controll the two others. But back to LD. In the next 5 1/2 month I want to see more from the game and I hope for a lot more informations.

The problems with three or soon for figure franchises at the same time is the hunt for them. I have no idea what is happening in this year with Activision. In the last year it was no problem to get six more Swap Force characters and the two adventure packs, but to get 7 more Trap Masters, the two adventure packs and the two elemental packs in this year is awful. At least here in Germany. No idea how it is in other countries. All is full with figures, but no one of that I want. I needed several months to get Wallop, Krypt King and Wildfire. Last I was lucky enough to get a Kaos trap and the Light elemental pack. But I've no idea how many weeks or months I will need to get Blastermind or the Dark elemental pack.

Wherefore we need a game, where the hunt for the figures is game enough ?

thats my worse fear for this game, you never know when it suddenly get impossible or hard to get the figures. im not gonna collect everything but one of each new figure is something i want to have. so far the wave 4 have been a real struggle...

I think it's silly to condemn Skylanders as a franchise.
This franchise is a MASSIVE juggernaut of cash for the games' developers and publisher.
All good things do come to an end, eventually, but that's not happening any time soon for Skylanders.

I am not sure why people even waste thoughts or time on this idea.
People posted the same type of "this will be the end of Skylanders!!" stuff when Disney Infinity was being released.
Skylanders is like the Energizer Bunny ... they keep going, and going, and going ...

Amiibos are heavily fan-boy geek/nerd/nostalgia based collectables. They do not appeal much to children. Ask kids; you'll see.

Stop worrying about "the end" for Skylanders, and definitely don't hold your breath waiting.
Either: Collect/play/enjoy, or, stop collecting/playing/enjoying. It's your freakin' choice. Don't wait around expecting the franchise to "die" and make the decision for you any time soon.

Quote: Bifrost

There's a huge difference. You're talking about a rhythm game that released dozens over dozens of games over the years with no change other than X new(minor) gimmick or new songs. New figures in Skylanders change the gameplay,even if the gameplay as a whole doesn't change,and if TFB and VV so wish they can make an entirely new genre for the next games and still keep the same support because the figures just register progress and upgrades,not HOW they'll play. If you're looking for reasons for the series to fail you'll only find them and not reasons why it won't.

It's really not a huge difference. You have to remove yourself from being a 'more hardcore fan' of the series, and think like a standard/typical parent.

To the average consumer 'they all look the same'. The only difference, Disney has characters who are recognizable. Like seriously, just talk to some parents at TRU next time you go. Then even going deeper than that, the gameplay hasn't changed since SSA, run around mashing 3 attack buttons, and changing characters because you want to or because the PayWall demands sacrifice. In Disney you now just have 2 attacks, but the idea is the same, with less PayWall in story, but more PayWall if you do Toy Box.

With the rhythm games, there were differences between versions and brands, hell they even broke out the Keytar for one game, but it didn't matter, it was still 'in general' the same concept.

I just hope this is the end of 'new' TtL games.
- Unreall

Bahamut: I didn't hear anyone lamenting the death of the game (at least not in the tone I picked up on)...just talking about real life marketing and planning dynamics for another TTL entry in the market. A bunch of what ifs as if we're the "experts"... if anything the group is hypersensitive and simply want to discuss cracks before they become dam busters.

Quote: Drek95

I'm aboard it too, never said I wansn't.
However one thing is saying it would be an appreciated feature another is saying it is mandatory these days.

That was clearly an exaggeration.

Nope, it's needed at this point in the franchise. Not mandatory from the game perspective, only if they want to risk their market share with excluding it. It's literally a prerequisite for me to buy toys this year. I've postponed/ignored this in the past but I'm really going to execute on this now that I have 250+ toys.

Perhaps I misinterpreted the tone of the thread when I read the title: "Skylanders getting destroyed in toys to life gaming?!!!!"

I just don't think fans should spend any time thinking about such things. Obviously, to each, his own, but this is intended to be FUN. And it is!
No need to spoil that with hum-drumming about marketing strategies and market shares and other crap that we have very little to no control over.

The problem with discussing "cracks" is that it's far too easy to "see" cracks that aren't actually there. The truth is that we don't even know what a "crack" looks like. We might *think* we know, we might want to *believe* we know, but we really, in actuality, do not know. So, why waste thoughts or time on it, ya know?

LOL, yeah the title is exaggerated for sure, but the conversation has been very even handed and civil.

Yeah, we all know about opinions and discussions---natural biases creep in. That's where drek keeps me honest and I keep other people honest with the back and forth.

Ya know, the "fun" discussions have been declining. I have a reason as to why, and may even justify its own thread. My guess is that the "newness" of the gameplay has worn off and in Trap Team there wasn't much to do after the main event to discuss. People love a conspiracy theory I guess. Gotta have the drama.

Quote: Drek95

Quote: FaboulousFab

The equation is pretty simple, if Vic. Vision doesn't follow the money grabber Trap Team, forget the weak mechanic of light/dark. If they found a way to bring to life old figs, giving a solid reason for fans to not give up the franchise it will works.

If it's a lazy gimmick, openly made to buy tasteless fig, any fan buying it deserves to be stolen.
And come on, we're in 2015, online features are obligatory.

The existance of other franchises like "Marty, the dolorean!!", or "mickey star wars" won't forgive any mistake.

Those are mostly personal opinion, which I respect but don't share.
Here's are mine.

I don't see how Trap Team would be more "money gabber" than every other previous Skylanders game.

*sarcasm mode on*
"Uuuuuh, it requires me to buy thousands of traps even if I could simply settle with one per Element and even tells me that I need at least one Trap Master per Element which is totally different from how SWAP Force required at least a character per movement type, not to mention the 4 Adventure Packs who gives me replayability, but who cares?! Robbers!"
*sarcasm mode off*

I don't like the gimmick of the Trap Masters, it could have been developed better but I love the majority of the characters.
I love the trap gimmick and looking forward to see it supported and maybe improved in Skylanders 5.
And I am really interested to see how V.V. will deal with the Light and Dark Elements; I would be completely fine even if they won't add new characters but they will have to acknowledge them in some way.

Online mandatory?
Please don't even get me started with it, I'll just assume you purposely exaggerated there.

Other franchises should watch their backs too if we want to boil it down to these terms.
Amiibos are already "failing" as TtL figures and frankly Disney Infinity 2.0 doesn't seem to have innovated that much from his 1.0 version.

Oh yes, it's totally subjective and had some exagerations.. but not that much.
I still get this feeling that trap team took the dark path of marketing.
Too much late decisions had been taken for bad purpose.
I also felt the adventure pack (only get 2 light and train) were quite weak in terms on content.

And when i've finished the game, the arenas and kaos mode, it was simply over, no replayability.
The score and attack modes were the motivation to keep playing swap force (that i still do sometimes)
The lack of online is also a huge problem.
With coop koas mod and (sorry ) PVP, the game would still be played.
We would talk about tiers, tournament, emulation for competition.
We wouldn't have even noticed the lego annoucement

^ I agree with your criticisms. I've made similar comments here on all the areas you touched. I'm actually playing Swap Force again because I'm still not done there...with Trap Team...there's nothing to do (short of just starting a new save file and doing it again).

My son hasn't finished story mode yet so we're pacing ourselves on purpose so we'll have a reason to play the last 5 or so that's remaining.

Quote: FaboulousFab

Quote: Drek95

Quote: FaboulousFab

The equation is pretty simple, if Vic. Vision doesn't follow the money grabber Trap Team, forget the weak mechanic of light/dark. If they found a way to bring to life old figs, giving a solid reason for fans to not give up the franchise it will works.

If it's a lazy gimmick, openly made to buy tasteless fig, any fan buying it deserves to be stolen.
And come on, we're in 2015, online features are obligatory.

The existance of other franchises like "Marty, the dolorean!!", or "mickey star wars" won't forgive any mistake.

Those are mostly personal opinion, which I respect but don't share.
Here's are mine.

I don't see how Trap Team would be more "money gabber" than every other previous Skylanders game.

*sarcasm mode on*
"Uuuuuh, it requires me to buy thousands of traps even if I could simply settle with one per Element and even tells me that I need at least one Trap Master per Element which is totally different from how SWAP Force required at least a character per movement type, not to mention the 4 Adventure Packs who gives me replayability, but who cares?! Robbers!"
*sarcasm mode off*

I don't like the gimmick of the Trap Masters, it could have been developed better but I love the majority of the characters.
I love the trap gimmick and looking forward to see it supported and maybe improved in Skylanders 5.
And I am really interested to see how V.V. will deal with the Light and Dark Elements; I would be completely fine even if they won't add new characters but they will have to acknowledge them in some way.

Online mandatory?
Please don't even get me started with it, I'll just assume you purposely exaggerated there.

Other franchises should watch their backs too if we want to boil it down to these terms.
Amiibos are already "failing" as TtL figures and frankly Disney Infinity 2.0 doesn't seem to have innovated that much from his 1.0 version.

Oh yes, it's totally subjective and had some exagerations.. but not that much.
I still get this feeling that trap team took the dark path of marketing.
Too much late decisions had been taken for bad purpose.
I also felt the adventure pack (only get 2 light and train) were quite weak in terms on content.

And when i've finished the game, the arenas and kaos mode, it was simply over, no replayability.
The score and attack modes were the motivation to keep playing swap force (that i still do sometimes)
The lack of online is also a huge problem.
With coop koas mod and (sorry ) PVP, the game would still be played.
We would talk about tiers, tournament, emulation for competition.
We wouldn't have even noticed the lego annoucement

I absolutely agree and if that was truly an exaggeration then I will forget about that aspect and focus on what you just said.

Online is needed in my opinion for the exact reasons that you just said: more replayability, possibility to build a bigger and solid fanbase where Portal Masters can challenge distant friends, maybe a leaderboard to see the strongest champions.

It would, on the other hand, partially ruin the idea of "taking your toys to a friend's home and play directly with him/her" but that was a cute concept until SWAP Force.

Now it would be a bit difficult taking ALL my collection to a friend's home, like I would want to (not really good at choosing who's in and who's out)...

I don't know that Skylanders is in danger of dying anytime soon. However, I do think that this is going to be a really important year for Activision innovate something and come out guns blazing.

The past two years, I think Disney Infinity and Amiibo have presented weak competition. Although I bought DI for my son, he has played it twice and I haven't really bought any additional figures because he isn't interested in playing it. I played it some and thought it was really boring, and we didn't even buy DI 2.0. I have some Amiibos, but I think they are largely worthless shelf warmers because I don't play Super Smash Bros. (and my son is way to young for it) and they aren't good for much else right now.

However, this holiday season you are going to have:

(1) Disney Infinity Star Wars (Star Wars Figures + Star Wars Game = Profit) plus

(2) Lego Dimensions (Lego Movie + DC Comics + Simpsons + LOTR + Ninjago + likely Chima at some point...all really strong franchises) plus

(3) Amiibo (If Nintendo can actually create things for these figures to do in game other than unlocking new skins, things are going to get interesting).


Again, I still prefer Skylanders over everything that is currently on the market. However, at some point Disney and Nintendo are going to stop bumbling around and release an improved product, and the new Lego game has the potential to be huge.

I think this year will tell us a lot about Activision's ability to out-innovate everyone else and stay at the top of the heap. If they don't have something really cool and innovative to keep everyone interested, I think it could be a disappointing year for Activision.

I really think Skylanders has the potential to stick it out even with Lego Dimensions in the mix. Every store I've gone to has had nearly full racks of DI and DI 2.0, but most every one of them has had a half empty or nearly empty Skylanders display. And amiibos are too full of Mario, Link, and Pikachu for them to be restocked any time soon.

I really do think if the market forces one of the four players out, it will be Disney Infinity. Even though Disney has a huge collector's market, I just don't see people running out and scooping up new characters. Even the Marvel ones have sat largely untouched for awhile at all my local shops.

Amiibo will continue to be an understocked hot seller, and Skylanders will square off against Lego Dimensions for top dog. And in my own experience from working retail with Skylanders, parents LOVE that all the games are forward compatible. I would always tell them how I still use my S:SA army in Giants, SWAP Force, and Trap Team. I've met children who collect the figures without owning the games, and I've met parents who will buy their kids the new games just to have them reuse their older figures again and again.

As interesting as Lego Dimensions sounds, I think a lot of people are going to be turned off by just how familiar it may play to Lego Star Wars, or Lego Lord of the Rings, or Lego Chima, or Lego Ninjago, or Lego I've made my Point.